========================================================================= Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 01:52:55 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Mary Ann Solstad Subject: Re: 2nd call for poster presentations in New Orlens In-Reply-To: <4.1.19990331100323.00a13740@postoffice.ehs.uiuc.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 10:08 AM 3/31/99 -0600, you wrote: >At the summer American Chemical Society national meeting in New Orleans >this August, the Division of Chemical Technicians is organizing a symposium >entitled, "Safety Issues in Our Laboratories." As part of this symposium, >I am organizing a poster symposium on compliance with the OSHA Laboratory >Standard. This would consist of presentations on institutional and >departmental strategies for compliance with the Standard, as well as >chemical hygiene plans and training programs. > Hi, Pete, We missed you. Just saw this note. Are we co-sponsoring or co-listing?? Mary Ann ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 08:54:00 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Robert Murphy Subject: Explosives, OSHA, & NFPA - Determined Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" With the help of Bill, Debbie, and Mary Ann, it is apparent that in regards to the reactivity section of HMIS and NFPA, they do not define what is considered to be explosive in the same way. I would like to clarify some points that were brought up during the discussion: 1. In the NFPA 704 Standard (the fire diamond) it does state in its scope that the rankings address health, fammability, instability, and related hazards that are presented by short-term, acute exposure to a material under conditions of FIRE, SPILL, OR SIMILAR EMERGANCIES. It also states in the applicability section that the standard is not intended to address occupational exposures. Regardless of what the standard does state regrading scope and applicability, almost all companies who sell hazard communication supplies sells the NFPA fire diamond as a means of complying with haz com. Many chemical manufactures use the NFPA label as part of their hazard warning system on their labels of hazardous matierls. Whether we like it or not, it is a fact that many businesses use this system as their hazard communication labeling system. I would like to point out its similarities and differences to the OSHA definitions. I want to provide employees with useful information and if they are going to use the NFPA label, I want to show them it limitations and usefulness. In terms of ACUTE toxicity and flammability, NFPA and OSHA use the same criteria (see defintions of toxic, highly toxic, combustable, and flammable in 29 CFR 1910.1200 and NFPA 704 Standard System for the Identification of the Hazards of Materials for Emergancy Response 1996 Edition). 2. It is true that HMIS was initially developed for the paint and coatings industry. However, the scope and applicability of the system has been expanded since the time of its orginal development to other hazardous chemicals in the workplace (laboratories included). LabelMaster now has marketing rights over the HMIS system and has put out a HMIS Implementation Manual to assist employers with labeling chemicals in the work place. In the implementation guide are the criteria that is used to classify the rankings of health, flammability, and reactivity. The health ranking criteria uses the OSHA definitions of Toxic and highly toxic. They also use skin and eye irriation data to rank the health hazard of a chemical. HMIS references that their flammability and reactivity ratings are the ratings used by NFPA. Therefore, in rating flammability, HMIS uses the criteria used in OSHA's Haz Com for combustable and flammable. 3. I disagree that the HEALTH concerns of someone planning an experiement in a lab is different than someone useing the same or similar chemical in a pilot plant. Toxicity is toxicity, flammability is flammability, regardless of the setting. ****** There is so much information that workers have to be trained on just within the scope of OSHA. I am trying to keep what they need to know to a simple level. They do not know what 0,1,2,3, or 4 means on NFPA and HMIS lables unless they have something of reference to compare them to. Thank you to everyone who has participated in this discussion. I hope we all got something good out of it. My appoligies to the list members who are sick of this subject (written with humor intensions). Bob ****************************************** Robert Murphy, Industrial Hygienist Environmental Health and Safety Bowling Green State University Phone: (419) 372-2171 ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 11:56:46 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Mary Ann Solstad Subject: Re: Explosives, OSHA, & NFPA - Determined In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19990401085400.00824de0@popm.bgsu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Have to disagree with you there, Bob. Compare adding 1 ml of 6N HCl to a reaction, vs pouring 50 liters in a pilot plant, and in another direction, using 0.1 ml in a microscale lab. Only really a health concern in the pilot plant. In addition the mass/volume ratio changes as you scale up. One can imagine dozens of comparisons. Now the intrinsic properties of a substance which might affect health remain the same (i.e. pH, LD50), but the health concerns are very different. Today's shift to universal PPE, and read the MSDS before doing anything, have made many of us think that everything is scary under all conditions, partly because the MSDS was originally designed for 55 gal drums or tank cars full of the stuff spilling. Some things are bad even in small amounts, e.g. HF, Na, Hg (mainly because it escapes recapture if you spill it). Many more are not. Still wouldn't drink them. Mary Ann 08:54 AM 4/1/99 -0500, you wrote: -big snip- >3. I disagree that the HEALTH concerns of someone planning an experiement >in a lab is different than someone useing the same or similar chemical in a >pilot plant. Toxicity is toxicity, flammability is flammability, >regardless of the setting. > >****** >Bob > > >****************************************** >Robert Murphy, Industrial Hygienist >Environmental Health and Safety >Bowling Green State University >Phone: (419) 372-2171 > Mary Ann Solstad, CIH 4 A's of Safety SOLSTAD Health & Safety Evaluations Attitude 16 Pequot Rd, Marblehead, MA 01945 Awareness 781-631-4748 tel, 781-631-1832 FAX Automatic Application Authority Past Chair, DivCHAS, ACS msolstad@mediaone.net ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 13:06:24 -0800 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "John M. Neil" Subject: basic skills literature Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I recently started working a large university research group doing thermochemistry of inorganic materials. The group is both multidisciplinary (chemistry,geology, material science, and a variety of engineering disciplines) and international. Needless-to-say the level of training varies greatly and what would be considered a comon sense activity or procedure to a chemist is a totally new experience to others trained in other disciplines and in other countries. I need some sort of guide to basic lab skills that I can have people read so that everyone is operating from some, known, basic level. Ideally, it would be a set of 20 to 30 page phamphlets although I won't be adverse to a book. Topics should cover chemistry lab skills (how to transfer powders, ways to mix reagents, how to clean glassware, etc.), using mechanical equipment (vacuum pumps, ovens and furnaces, etc.), laboratory safety (probably the easiest to find), use of basic tools (only use metric tools with metric fasteners, don't hammer with a wrench, etc.), principals of measuring (sources of errors, how to connect), etc. Doing things the right way (and knowing the tricks-of-the-trade), increases safety and efficiency. John M. Neil Thermochemistry Facility Department of Chemical Engineering & Material Science University of California at Davis One Shields Avenue Davis, CA 95616-8779 phone: (530) 754-2130 Fax: (530) 752-9307 "Entropy isn't what it use to be." ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 16:08:33 CDT Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: John Yunker Subject: Radiation & HazMat Training Programs from Harvard Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Dear Colleague, The Harvard School of Public Health is pleased to offer the following professional training programs. We are happy to mail or fax you a brochure upon request, or you can get more information at: http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/ccpe Radioactivity in the Environment: Risk, Assessment, and Measurement May 18-21 Atmospheric Science and Risk Projections for Hazardous and Radioactive Materials Releases May 25 - 28 Thank you. ===================================== Center for Continuing Professional Education Harvard School of Public Health 677 Huntington Avenue, LL-23 Boston, MA 02115-6096 Phone: (617) 432-1171 Fax: (617) 432-1969 Email: contedu@sph.harvard.edu http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/ccpe ===================================== ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 16:16:19 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "Thomas J. Shelley" Subject: Re: basic skills literature In-Reply-To: <3.0.3.32.19990401130624.00952b70@blue.ucdavis.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > I recently started working a large university research group doing >thermochemistry of inorganic materials. The group is both >multidisciplinary (chemistry,geology, material science, and a variety of >engineering disciplines) and international. Needless-to-say the level of >training varies greatly and what would be considered a comon sense activity >or procedure to a chemist is a totally new experience to others trained in >other disciplines and in other countries. > I need some sort of guide to basic lab skills that I can have >people read >so that everyone is operating from some, known, basic level. Ideally, it >would be a set of 20 to 30 page phamphlets although I won't be adverse to a >book. John--I would start with "Safety in Academic Chemistry Laboratories," published by then American Chemical Society. It is a concise overview of safety for undergraduate chemistry labs, including lab techniques, some of which will be useful for your program. The ISBN is 0-8412-3259-8. Tom Shelley ********************************************************* Tom Shelley, Chemical Hygiene Officer, Cornell University Department of Environmental Health and Safety, 125 Humphreys Service Building, Ithaca, NY 14853. (607) 255-4288 tjs1@cornell.edu ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 15:14:19 -0700 Reply-To: terrie@cc.usu.edu Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Terrie Wierenga Organization: USDA-ARS PPRL Subject: Re: basic skills literature MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------79432858940F56621C692E80" --------------79432858940F56621C692E80 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit John wrote (in part): > I need some sort of guide to basic lab skills that I can have people read > so that everyone is operating from some, known, basic level. Ideally, it > would be a set of 20 to 30 page phamphlets although I won't be adverse to a > book. Topics should cover chemistry lab skills (how to transfer powders, > ways to mix reagents, how to clean glassware, etc.), using mechanical > equipment (vacuum pumps, ovens and furnaces, etc.), laboratory safety > (probably the easiest to find), use of basic tools (only use metric tools > with metric fasteners, don't hammer with a wrench, etc.), principals of > measuring (sources of errors, how to connect), etc. Doing things the right > way (and knowing the tricks-of-the-trade), increases safety and efficiency. > > I just received a lab skills guide that I think it is pretty good for guiding folks in the basic skills. It is a book published by Cold Spring Harbor Laboratory Press entitled "At The Bench: A Laboratory Navigator." ISBN is 0-87969-523-4; author is Kathy Barker. It covers the basics you mentioned above plus gives guidance in a number of other areas. I'm already incorporating several chapters of it into our "assigned reading" for new lab hires. Hope this helps-- Terrie *My opinion only; mention of a product should not be construed as an endorsement by USDA-ARS* -- **** Terrie Wierenga, CDSO, LRPO USDA-ARS Poisonous Plant Research Lab 1150 East 1400 North Logan, UT 84341 v: 435-752-2941 f: 435-753-5681 e: terrie@cc.usu.edu --------------79432858940F56621C692E80 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit John wrote (in part): 
        I need some sort of guide to basic lab skills that I can have people read
so that everyone is operating from some, known, basic level.  Ideally, it
would be a set of 20 to 30 page phamphlets although I won't be adverse to a
book.  Topics should cover chemistry lab skills (how to transfer powders,
ways to mix reagents, how to clean glassware, etc.), using mechanical
equipment (vacuum pumps, ovens and furnaces, etc.), laboratory safety
(probably the easiest to find), use of basic tools (only use metric tools
with metric fasteners, don't hammer with a wrench, etc.), principals of
measuring (sources of errors, how to connect), etc.  Doing things the right
way (and knowing the tricks-of-the-trade), increases safety and efficiency.


I just received a lab skills guide that I think it is pretty good for guiding folks in the basic skills.  It is a book published by Cold Spring Harbor Laboratory Press entitled "At The Bench:  A Laboratory Navigator."  ISBN is 0-87969-523-4; author is Kathy Barker.  It covers the basics you mentioned above plus gives guidance in a number of other areas.  I'm already incorporating several chapters of it into our "assigned reading" for new lab hires.

Hope this helps--
Terrie

*My opinion only; mention of a product should not be construed as an endorsement by USDA-ARS*

--
****
Terrie Wierenga, CDSO, LRPO
USDA-ARS Poisonous Plant Research Lab
1150 East 1400 North
Logan, UT 84341

v:  435-752-2941
f:  435-753-5681
e:  terrie@cc.usu.edu
  --------------79432858940F56621C692E80-- ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 16:34:05 -0600 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Katie Crysup Subject: Re: basic skills literature In-Reply-To: <3.0.3.32.19990401130624.00952b70@blue.ucdavis.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" When you come up with one let me know, we have many of the same problems. At 01:06 PM 4/1/99 -0800, you wrote: > I recently started working a large university research group doing >thermochemistry of inorganic materials. The group is both >multidisciplinary (chemistry,geology, material science, and a variety of >engineering disciplines) and international. Needless-to-say the level of >training varies greatly and what would be considered a comon sense activity >or procedure to a chemist is a totally new experience to others trained in >other disciplines and in other countries. > I need some sort of guide to basic lab skills that I can have people read >so that everyone is operating from some, known, basic level. Ideally, it >would be a set of 20 to 30 page phamphlets although I won't be adverse to a >book. Topics should cover chemistry lab skills (how to transfer powders, >ways to mix reagents, how to clean glassware, etc.), using mechanical >equipment (vacuum pumps, ovens and furnaces, etc.), laboratory safety >(probably the easiest to find), use of basic tools (only use metric tools >with metric fasteners, don't hammer with a wrench, etc.), principals of >measuring (sources of errors, how to connect), etc. Doing things the right >way (and knowing the tricks-of-the-trade), increases safety and efficiency. > > >John M. Neil > >Thermochemistry Facility >Department of Chemical Engineering & Material Science >University of California at Davis >One Shields Avenue >Davis, CA 95616-8779 > >phone: (530) 754-2130 Fax: (530) 752-9307 > >"Entropy isn't what it use to be." > > Katie Crysup Chemistry Laboratory Coordinator Texas A&M University -- Corpus Christi 6300 Ocean Drive, CS 130 Corpus Christi, Tx 78412 512-994-5701 (O) 512-994-2742 (F) kcrysup@falcon.tamucc.edu ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 17:23:21 EST Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Labsafe@AOL.COM Subject: Re: basic skills literature Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit In a message dated 4/1/99 4:17:54 PM Eastern Standard Time, tjs1@CORNELL.EDU writes: << John--I would start with "Safety in Academic Chemistry Laboratories," published by then American Chemical Society. It is a concise overview of safety for undergraduate chemistry labs, including lab techniques, some of which will be useful for your program. The ISBN is 0-8412-3259-8. >> Hi NACHOs, Remember, this 80-page book is free (one copy) from ACS. Call 1-800-ACS-5558 and request (demand!) yours. For 2-199 copies they charge $3.50 each. Don't do that. Get them from LSW for $2.50 each (2-199 copies). Available at our web site (www.labsafety.org). ... Jim Lab Safety Workshop 192 Worcester Road Natick, MA 01760 1-508-647-1900 ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 16:45:08 -0800 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Michael Ahler Subject: Bleach Substitutes? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; name="Bleach" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Greetings NACHO's Here is a new one. The manager(s) of the custodial staff here (Housing/dormitory area and "other state buildings" areas) have removed bleach from the inventory of materials their employees use. Bleach is seen as too much of a risk from these points of view: 1. intrinsic hazard of this alkaline, oxidizing, irritant, 2. perception (and subsequent use) as " straight out of the bottle" being a better cleaner/mold and mildew remover than various dilutions, and 3. penchant of some employees to mix cleaners ( despite instructions to the contrary) to perform better cleaning. Yes, I realize the training issue operating here, but I am wondering if anyone knows of a product that works about as well as bleach for tile cleaning. Shower rooms in the dormitories are especially problematical. I told the group recently, during Haz Com training, that I would ask around. Please reply 1-on-1 if wisdom strikes you. Thanks. Michael Ahler, CHO reply to: mahler@calpoly.edu Risk Management Cal Poly San Luis Obispo, California ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 2 Apr 1999 08:15:04 -0600 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Peter Ashbrook In-Reply-To: <199904020600.AAA80730@saluki-mail.siu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=====================_878182==_.ALT" --=====================_878182==_.ALT Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 12:00 AM 4/2/99 -0600, you wrote: > > Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 01:52:55 -0500 > From: Mary Ann Solstad > Subject: Re: 2nd call for poster presentations in New Orlens > > At 10:08 AM 3/31/99 -0600, you wrote: > >At the summer American Chemical Society national meeting in New Orleans > >this August, the Division of Chemical Technicians is organizing a symposium > >entitled, "Safety Issues in Our Laboratories." As part of this symposium, > >I am organizing a poster symposium on compliance with the OSHA Laboratory > >Standard. This would consist of presentations on institutional and > >departmental strategies for compliance with the Standard, as well as > >chemical hygiene plans and training programs. > > Hi, Pete, > We missed you. Just saw this note. Are we co-sponsoring or co-listing?? > > Mary Ann The Division of Chemical Health and Safety is co-sponsoring the overall symposium. Abstracts for the poster session on chemical hygiene plans and training programs (I am still looking for more posters!) should be submitted electronically through the Division of Chemical Health and Safety. Please contact me if you are interested. Peter C. Ashbrook, CHMM, Assistant Director Chemical Safety Section Division of Environmental Health and Safety University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign 217/244-9278 --=====================_878182==_.ALT Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" At 12:00 AM 4/2/99 -0600, you wrote:

Date:    Thu, 1 Apr 1999 01:52:55 -0500
From:    Mary Ann Solstad <msolstad@MEDIAONE.NET>
Subject: Re: 2nd call for poster presentations in New Orlens

At 10:08 AM 3/31/99 -0600, you wrote:
>At the summer American Chemical Society national meeting in New Orleans
>this August, the Division of Chemical Technicians is organizing a symposium
>entitled, "Safety Issues in Our Laboratories."  As part of this symposium,
>I am organizing a poster symposium on compliance with the OSHA Laboratory
>Standard. This would consist of presentations on institutional and
>departmental strategies for compliance with the Standard, as well as
>chemical hygiene plans and training programs.

Hi, Pete,
We missed you.  Just saw this note.  Are we co-sponsoring or co-listing??

Mary Ann

The Division of Chemical Health and Safety is co-sponsoring the overall symposium. Abstracts for the poster session on chemical hygiene plans and training programs (I am still looking for more posters!) should be submitted electronically through the Division of Chemical Health and Safety. Please contact me if you are interested.


Peter C. Ashbrook, CHMM, Assistant Director
Chemical Safety Section
Division of Environmental Health and Safety
University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign
217/244-9278 --=====================_878182==_.ALT-- ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 2 Apr 1999 11:41:34 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Mary Ann Solstad Subject: Re: Bleach Substitutes? In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 04:45 PM 4/1/99 -0800, you wrote: >Greetings NACHO's > >Here is a new one. >The manager(s) of the custodial staff here (Housing/dormitory area and >"other state buildings" areas) have removed bleach from the inventory of >materials their employees use. Bleach is seen as too much of a risk >from these points of view: >1. intrinsic hazard of this alkaline, oxidizing, irritant, >2. perception (and subsequent use) as " straight out of the bottle" >being a better cleaner/mold and mildew remover than various dilutions, >and >3. penchant of some employees to mix cleaners ( despite instructions >to the contrary) to perform better cleaning. > >Yes, I realize the training issue operating here, but > >I am wondering if anyone knows of a product that works about as well as >bleach for tile cleaning. Shower rooms in the dormitories are >especially problematical. >I told the group recently, during Haz Com training, that I would ask >around. > >Please reply 1-on-1 if wisdom strikes you. >Thanks. > > > >Michael Ahler, CHO >reply to: mahler@calpoly.edu >Risk Management >Cal Poly >San Luis Obispo, California > When Right to Know, rather than HazCom, was still around I was hired to do some training to housekeeping crew at a public college. They all spoke another language, but the Dean offered to translate. All the problems with incorrect use you mentioned were present. During the question period some women complained of facial irritation and their eyebrows eaten off. I asked one to show me what was used. It was in a plain white bottle with spray top. Embossed on the bottom was conc. HCl. (actually muriatic acid, I think). They were under supv. orders to spray showers with that every day. The showers were very clean. The college immediately collected such data sheets as were available and we scheduled some more training. Mary Ann Mary Ann Solstad, CIH 4 A's of Safety SOLSTAD Health & Safety Evaluations Attitude 16 Pequot Rd, Marblehead, MA 01945 Awareness 781-631-4748 tel, 781-631-1832 FAX Automatic Application Authority Past Chair, DivCHAS, ACS msolstad@mediaone.net ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 2 Apr 1999 11:05:52 -0600 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Norbert Norman Subject: Lab Basic Safety Skills MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In answer to John Neil's question about sources for basic safety and skill training sources for work in laboratories, I think the Nat'l Research Council's book entitled "Prudent Practices in the Laboratory" contains excellent and quite comprehensive information. We distributed a copy to all of our lab safety coordinators in departments which have laboratories. It is also quoted extensively in our Chemical Hygiene Plan and utilized for training. ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 2 Apr 1999 13:37:52 EST Reply-To: PROFDHW@aol.com Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Dave Williams Subject: Re: Lab Basic Safety Skills MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 04/02/1999 12:07:39 PM, nnorman@D.UMN.EDU writes: >I think the Nat'l Research >Council's book entitled "Prudent Practices in the Laboratory" contains >excellent and quite comprehensive information. What and where is the Nat'l Research Council? Dave Williams Chair, Science Department Valencia Community College, East Campus 701 N. Econlockhatchee Trail Orlando, FL 32825 407-299-5000 x2443 profdhw@aol.com ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 4 Apr 1999 14:22:19 EDT Reply-To: Labsafe@aol.com Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Labsafe@AOL.COM Subject: New Lab Safety Poster Comments: To: Safety , nsela-l@science.coe.uwf.edu, NAOSMM@listserv.rice.edu, hs-canada@ccohs.ca, dchas-l@siu.edu, chemed-l@atlantis.uwf.edu, CHEMCOM@listserv.acsu.buffalo.edu, biosafty@mitvma.mit.edu, APCHEM-L@listserv.acsu.buffalo.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The Laboratory Safety Workshop has a new Guidelines Poster. LSW's "Laboratory Safety Guidelines: 40 Suggestions for a Safer Lab" are now available in an attractive, colorful, and fun 24" x 36" poster. Thanks to Carolina Biological Supply Company for the graphics, design, and printing. ***************************************************** James A. Kaufman, Director The Laboratory Safety Workshop Safety in Science Education 192 Worcester Road, Natick, MA 01760 508-647-1900 Fax: 508-647-0062 labsafe@aol.com http://www.labsafety.org/ LSW is a national non-profit educational organization dedicated to making health and safety an integral and important part of science education. Free copies of our Laboratory Safety Guidelines, seminar schedule, Publications List, AV-Lending Library List, and membership information are available on request. The LABSAFETY-L discussion list is a public service of LSW. ****************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 4 Apr 1999 14:37:13 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "Henry Boyter Jr." Subject: Re: New Lab Safety Poster Comments: To: Labsafe@aol.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit How do we get it? Is there a cost? Dr. Henry Boyter, Jr. Ph.D. Chemist The opinions of Dr. Boyter are provided for informational purposes only and should not be used as advice. No warranty or expression of professionalism is implied. *************** -----Original Message----- From: Labsafe@aol.com To: LABSAFETY-L@SIU.EDU Date: Sunday, April 04, 1999 2:19 PM Subject: New Lab Safety Poster The Laboratory Safety Workshop has a new Guidelines Poster. LSW's "Laboratory Safety Guidelines: 40 Suggestions for a Safer Lab" are now available in an attractive, colorful, and fun 24" x 36" poster. Thanks to Carolina Biological Supply Company for the graphics, design, and printing. ***************************************************** James A. Kaufman, Director The Laboratory Safety Workshop Safety in Science Education 192 Worcester Road, Natick, MA 01760 508-647-1900 Fax: 508-647-0062 labsafe@aol.com http://www.labsafety.org/ LSW is a national non-profit educational organization dedicated to making health and safety an integral and important part of science education. Free copies of our Laboratory Safety Guidelines, seminar schedule, Publications List, AV-Lending Library List, and membership information are available on request. The LABSAFETY-L discussion list is a public service of LSW. ****************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 4 Apr 1999 22:32:55 EDT Reply-To: Labsafe@aol.com Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Labsafe@AOL.COM Subject: Re: New Lab Safety Poster MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 99-04-04 14:34:02 EDT, you write: << How do we get it? Is there a cost? Dr. Henry Boyter, Jr. Ph.D. Chemist >> The new poster can be ordered from the web site on the publication list, by fax, by email, or phone. Cost is $10.00 plus shipping and handling. ... Jim ***************************************************** James A. Kaufman, Director The Laboratory Safety Workshop Safety in Science Education 192 Worcester Road, Natick, MA 01760 508-647-1900 Fax: 508-647-0062 labsafe@aol.com http://www.labsafety.org/ LSW is a national non-profit educational organization dedicated to making health and safety an integral and important part of science education. Free copies of our Laboratory Safety Guidelines, seminar schedule, Publications List, AV-Lending Library List, and membership information are available on request. The LABSAFETY-L discussion list is a public service of LSW. ****************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 5 Apr 1999 07:07:20 -0700 Reply-To: Marc Neuffer Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Marc Neuffer Organization: SafetyInfo.Com Subject: Safety News MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit http://www.safetyinfo.com **********Week in Review***************** 1) What's New on Safety Info.Com 2) Preparing for Hot Weather 3) Top Safety News Stories of the Week 4) Respirator Change Out Schedules ********************************************** WHAT'S NEW ON SAFETY INFO.COM [Occ Health] - New Section! - currently we have 10 Medical Protocols (20 more by the end of the week) we will also be adding related forms, policies adn clip art as we build this secion over the next few weeks [Safety Poster] - Your Weekly Safety Poster is ready - best one yet! [Safety Brief] - also ready for this week - covers LOTO [Safety Training] - under [Safety Factors] - new training handout -> Machine Guards. We have also redesigned the Electrical, Lockout Tagout and Hand Tool SAFETY FACTORS to fit on one page. [What's New] - from our home page you can click on this to review most recent additions to our site. ************************************************************** PREPARING FOR HOT WEATHER While winter seems to just ending, many busineses are thinking ahead to the hot weather just around the corner. You may want to review the Safety Article "Protecting Workers in Hot Environments". One of the essentials is to provide plenty of fluid for drinking --- For those who use commercial drinks, nothing beats Quickick.... I use it on my Boy Scout campouts - the boys love it - great for atheletic teams too. Click on our QUICKICK sponsor to see their great prices - it will beat whatever you are currently using. ***************************************************************** TOP SAFETY NEWS OF THE WEEK OSHA Agrees to Recognize Crane Operator Certification OSHA will officially recognize the national crane operator certification program of the National Commission for the Certification of Crane Operators (NCCCO) as meeting OSHA requirements for crane operator proficiency. EPA Head Says Republican Budget Proposal Will Wreck Environmental Efforts She stated "the Republican budget resolution could roll back the basic protections to public health and the environment that Americans want and deserve. These cuts, if enacted, could affect EPA's ability to set public health standards that protect our communities. They could severely limit the enforcement of national laws that ensure safer food and safe drinking water. These cuts could limit our special efforts aimed specifically at protecting the health of children and communities. They could mean that cleanups of toxic waste sites will be delayed in communities across the nation. And they could mean that states will lose millions in resources for providing their citizens with healthier air and cleaner water." This sounds like election year politics to us. Fed Highway Administration Required New Refelctive Truck Standards The FHWA has amended the Federal Motor Carrier Safety Regulations (FMCSRs) to require that motor carriers engaged in interstate commerce install retroreflective tape or reflex reflectors on the sides and rear of semitrailers. The locations at which the retroreflective tape or reflex reflectors must be applied to trailers during the phase-in period is specified. [See Safety Engineering Prices on Reflective Truck Tape] ****************************************************************** RESPIRATOR CHANGE OUT SCHEDULES The revised OSHA Respiratory Protection Standard requires employers to develop a filter change out schedule based on use and environment.... many have written in asking how to accomplish this.... our recommendation is to check with the manufacturer... all the major manufacturers have developed a baseline change out plan.... Safety Engineering & Supply has just posted over 50 new prices for respirators of all types and styles .... these are the best prices ever seen .... I highly recommend using them... I did when I worked as a Safety Manager for a Fortune 500 company... these folks know what they're doing! ********************************************************************* Have a good week. Regards & Best Wishes Marc Neuffer Safety Info.Com ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 5 Apr 1999 13:40:30 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Fran Martin Subject: Updated TSCA + SARA III CD-ROM Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Lab health & safety professionals may find this reference useful: The updated U.S EPA Toxic Substance Control Act (TSCA) Chemical Inventory of 62,000 chemicals is available cross-referenced with SARA Title III RCRA reporting requirements on CD-ROM. It features SARA III fields integrated with TSCA information; select U.S. Code Chapters; CORR with TSCA 4, 5, 6, 8, and 12b (export) cross-references; EPA PMN; Canadian DSL/NDSL; European ELINCS; and Adobe(R) Acrobat(R) (PDF) format for instant search/retrieval. For details see http://www.env-sol.com/solutions/TSCASARA.HTML Fran Martin FM Research & Consulting ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 5 Apr 1999 13:40:54 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Katie Crysup Comments: To: bunngardner@yahoo.com, canhookem@aol.com, chiscano@hpl.hpl.umces.edu, collumb@utmsi.utmsi.utexas.edu, mike.crysup@mhmr.state.tx.us, DCrysup@HNTB.com, DaronD@jandw.com, shermco@gte.net, marylynn.yates@ucr.edu, fmiller@utmsi.utmsi.utexas.edu, smpflc@electrotex.com, clearwater-divers@io.com, golalde@falcon.tamucc.edu, teeanu@2fords.net, jerryb@falcon.tamucc.edu, jwallace@inu.net, lwiggin@brokersys.com, llister@dorado.port-aransas.k12.tx.us, fcrysup@yahoo.com, rbrooks@falcon.tamucc.edu, scott.lister@laitram.com Comments: cc: chemclub-list@batman.tamucc.edu, mmorvant@falcon.tamucc.edu, sbarnes@falcon.tamucc.edu, jloter@falcon.tamucc.edu, sharma@falcon.tamucc.edu, amdixon33@yahoo.com, q0h35296@kestrel.tamucc.edu, rlefevre@interconnect.net, aekolt@juno.com, ramses@trip.net, mer32918@kestrel.tamucc.edu, mst99803@kestrel.tamucc.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > Subject: It's a gas > > > > > > > > > THE GREAT "GAS OUT" > > > > > > > > It's time we did something about the price > > > > of gasoline in America! We are all sick and > > > > tired of high prices when there are literally > > > > millions of gallons in storage. > > > > Know what I found out? If there was just > > > > ONE day when no one purchased any > > > > gasoline, prices would drop drastically. > > > > The so-called oil cartel has decided to > > > > slow production by some 2 million barrels > > > > per day to drive up the price. I have decided > > > > to see how many Americans we can get > > > > to NOT BUY ANY GASOLINE on one > > > > particular day! > > > > Let's have a GAS OUT! Do not buy any > > > > gasoline on APRIL 30, 1999!!!!! > > > > Buy on Thursday before, or Saturday after. > > > > Do not buy any gasoline on FRIDAY, > > > > APRIL 30, 1999. > > > > Wanna help? Send this message to > > > > everyone you know. Ask them to do the same. > > > > All we need is a few million to participate in > > > > order to make a difference. > > > > > > We CAN make a difference. > > Katie Crysup Chemistry Laboratory Coordinator Texas A&M University -- Corpus Christi 6300 Ocean Drive, CS 130 Corpus Christi, Tx 78412 512-994-5701 (O) 512-994-2742 (F) kcrysup@falcon.tamucc.edu ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 5 Apr 1999 15:27:20 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "Stoll, Ilse (Ilse)" Comments: To: Katie Crysup MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain This message has nothing to do with lab safety. Our company policy prohibits company e-mail use for chain letters. Please do not use the Labsafety chatline for such messages. Thank you. Ilse Stoll ---------- From: Katie Crysup [SMTP:kcrysup@FALCON.TAMUCC.EDU] Sent: Monday, April 05, 1999 2:41 PM To: LABSAFETY-L@SIU.EDU > Subject: It's a gas > > > > > > > > > THE GREAT "GAS OUT" > > > > > > > > It's time we did something about the price > > > > of gasoline in America! We are all sick and > > > > tired of high prices when there are literally > > > > millions of gallons in storage. > > > > Know what I found out? If there was just > > > > ONE day when no one purchased any > > > > gasoline, prices would drop drastically. > > > > The so-called oil cartel has decided to > > > > slow production by some 2 million barrels > > > > per day to drive up the price. I have decided > > > > to see how many Americans we can get > > > > to NOT BUY ANY GASOLINE on one > > > > particular day! > > > > Let's have a GAS OUT! Do not buy any > > > > gasoline on APRIL 30, 1999!!!!! > > > > Buy on Thursday before, or Saturday after. > > > > Do not buy any gasoline on FRIDAY, > > > > APRIL 30, 1999. > > > > Wanna help? Send this message to > > > > everyone you know. Ask them to do the same. > > > > All we need is a few million to participate in > > > > order to make a difference. > > > > > > We CAN make a difference. > > Katie Crysup Chemistry Laboratory Coordinator Texas A&M University -- Corpus Christi 6300 Ocean Drive, CS 130 Corpus Christi, Tx 78412 512-994-5701 (O) 512-994-2742 (F) kcrysup@falcon.tamucc.edu ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 5 Apr 1999 16:50:29 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Jeff Rubin Subject: Re: Chain letters In-Reply-To: <3.0.1.16.19990405132832.3d3f289e@falcon.tamucc.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" "This message has nothing to do with lab safety. Please do not use the Labsafety chatline for such messages." Ditto! Worth saying "in public." JNR Jeff Rubin, Asst. Dean for EHS College of Natural Sciences G2500 W.C. Hogg Building University of Texas at Austin Austin, TX 78712-1199 (512) 471-6176 (O) (512) 471-4998 (F) jrubin@mail.utexas.edu http://www.utexas.edu/cons/safety/ "The opinions of Dr. Rubin are not meant to offend anyone unless otherwise specified." ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 5 Apr 1999 16:09:34 -0700 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Neal Langerman Subject: Commercial and New Web Site Info: Spill Response Information Comments: To: hs-canada@ccohs.ca, occ-med-l@list.mc.duke.edu, SAFETY@LIST.UVM.EDU Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I have just added a new Spill Response page to my web site. Visit it and I look forward to your comments. If you have a favorite chemical that requires special response handling, tell me about it, and I will try to add it to the list! http://www.chemical-safety.com/spill2.htm While you are on the site, visit the rest of it. Neal ************************************************************* NEAL LANGERMAN chemsaf@ix.netcom.com ADVANCED CHEMICAL SAFETY 8909 Complex Drive San Diego CA 92123-1418 619 874 5577 (phone) 619 874 8239 (FAX) 619 990 4908 (cellular) visit our homepage: http://www.chemical-safety.com ************************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 13:43:38 -0300 Reply-To: damar@wkve.com.br Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Damaris Silveira Duarte MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit A friend of mine is working with H3-tymidine, without no care about dispose or discharge this material. Any suggestion? Thanks a lot Dâmaris Silveira Duarte Centro de Ciências Exatas e Tecnológicas -CECET Universidade Vale do Rio Doce - UNIVALE rua Moreira Sales, 850, Vila Bretas Governador Valadares -Minas Gerais - Brasil CEP 35032-130 Tel: 55 033 2251717 ext.313 Fax: 55 033 2213185 e-mail: damaris@univale.br damar@wkve.com.br ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 15:54:08 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Dewey Williams Subject: Re: Chemical Storage Guides Comments: To: Gillian Gardner Comments: cc: NAOSMM@LISTSERV.RICE.EDU, SAFETY@LIST.UVM.EDU In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed What is the approved method of chemical organization; by hazard, chemical family, elimination of incompatible chemicals??? Ideally, elimination of storing incompatible chemicals together is the ideal situation, which segregation by hazard may not accomplish. Storing chemicals by chemical family may solve this, but what about multi-family compounds? Where do you store 2-chloro-benzylamine; with the halogenated compounds or with the amines? At 1/26/99 -0800, Gillian Gardner wrote: >I used the Aldrich catalog extensively when I went through this >reorganization as it tends to list the hazards in the description of each >chemical. > >Gillian Gardner >Lewis & Clark College > >On Tue, 26 Jan 1999, Brian Vermillion wrote: > >> Here at the University of Indianapolis, we are planning the >> reorganization of >> our chemical inventory. One arrangement under consideration involves >> grouping >> chemicals in compatible families (rather than arranging them >> alphabetically). >> >> I have found some lists of families of compatible chemicals (e.g., the one >> provided by Flinn Scientific). Unfortunately, these lists tend to be >> limited. >> >> Does anyone have any comprehensive lists (or other references) to recommend? >> >> Thanks for your help, >> -Brian Vermillion >> >> ----- >> Brian Vermillion >> Physical Science Lab Coordinator >> Departments of Chemistry and Physics/Earth-Space Sciences >> University of Indianapolis >> 1400 East Hanna Avenue >> Indianapolis, IN 46227 >> >> Office: (317) 788-2101 >> Fax: (317) 788-3569 >> Email: bvermillion@uindy.edu >> Dewey Williams - Lab Manager mailto:williams@email.uncc.edu UNC-Charlotte Chemistry Dept. http://www.chem.uncc.edu "These are my ideas and no one else will claim them." "If you are not part of the solution, you are part of the precipitate" ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 16:16:58 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Naomi Kelly Subject: Re: Decon of PPE with UV light In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" The Model 2000 Germicidal cabinet sold by Fisher claims to sanitize up to 35 goggles in 5 minutes. Does anyone know if that is the case or not? At 01:29 PM 3/30/99 -0500, you wrote: >Hello Naomi. > >When decontaminating goggles and safety glasses UV takes time. If you want >a fairly quick decon, use a 2% solution of clorox and water for 5 minutes. >Rinse and dry and you are good to go. > >For what it's worth, Janeen. > >***************** >Janeen Lapierre, CHO >College of Osteopathic Medicine >University of New England >11 Hills Beach Road >Biddeford, ME 04005 > >E-Mail: JLaPierre@MAILBOX.UNE.EDU >Phone: (207) 283-0170 ext 2446 >Opinions are mine and not those of UNE. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 17:48:13 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Janeen LaPierre Subject: Re: Decon of PPE with UV light Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sounds too good to be true to me. Keep in mind that as the UV bulbs age, they become less effective. So, perhaps they work in 5 minutes out of the box but I would like to see how many hours of operation it takes to reduce this efficiency. I'm not familiar with this unit, but I will get some info and ask my Micro guys what they think. Janeen ***************** Janeen Lapierre, CHO College of Osteopathic Medicine University of New England 11 Hills Beach Road Biddeford, ME 04005 E-Mail: JLaPierre@MAILBOX.UNE.EDU Phone: (207) 283-0170 ext 2446 Opinions are mine and not those of UNE. >>> Naomi Kelly - 4/7/99 4:16 PM >>> The Model 2000 Germicidal cabinet sold by Fisher claims to sanitize up to 35 goggles in 5 minutes. Does anyone know if that is the case or not? ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 18:10:36 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Mary Ann Solstad Subject: Re: Chemical Storage Guides In-Reply-To: <4.2.0.32.19990407154448.0099fc60@newmail.uncc.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Latch on to a copy of "Safe Storage of Laboratory Chemicals" by Piptone, Wiley-Interscience. I saw once where it was referenced approvingly by L. Bretherick, dean of authoritative info. on reactive chemicals (which reacted when they shouldn't have). Did anyone there seriously consider alphabetical storage?? If so, shame on them. In addition take account of no aggressive acids or bases above eye level, no large bottles above waste level, or even knees, put little vials or small jars on deep trays for easier retrieval. Also deep trays for liquids is good for spill control. Fasten backs or tops of shelving to studs, joists or other substantial members. Any chance at all for quakes, put lips or other preventers on all shelf edges, and latches on cupboard doors. Mary Ann At 03:54 PM 4/7/99 -0400, you wrote: >What is the approved method of chemical organization; by hazard, chemical >family, elimination of incompatible chemicals??? > >Ideally, elimination of storing incompatible chemicals together is the >ideal situation, which segregation by hazard may not accomplish. Storing >chemicals by chemical family may solve this, but what about multi-family >compounds? Where do you store 2-chloro-benzylamine; with the halogenated >compounds or with the amines? > >At 1/26/99 -0800, Gillian Gardner wrote: >>I used the Aldrich catalog extensively when I went through this >>reorganization as it tends to list the hazards in the description of each >>chemical. >> >>Gillian Gardner >>Lewis & Clark College >> >>On Tue, 26 Jan 1999, Brian Vermillion wrote: >> >>> Here at the University of Indianapolis, we are planning the >>> reorganization of >>> our chemical inventory. One arrangement under consideration involves >>> grouping >>> chemicals in compatible families (rather than arranging them >>> alphabetically). >>> >>> I have found some lists of families of compatible chemicals (e.g., the one >>> provided by Flinn Scientific). Unfortunately, these lists tend to be >>> limited. >>> >>> Does anyone have any comprehensive lists (or other references) to recommend? >>> >>> Thanks for your help, >>> -Brian Vermillion >>> >>> ----- >>> Brian Vermillion >>> Physical Science Lab Coordinator >>> Departments of Chemistry and Physics/Earth-Space Sciences >>> University of Indianapolis >>> 1400 East Hanna Avenue >>> Indianapolis, IN 46227 >>> >>> Office: (317) 788-2101 >>> Fax: (317) 788-3569 >>> Email: bvermillion@uindy.edu >>> > >Dewey Williams - Lab Manager >mailto:williams@email.uncc.edu >UNC-Charlotte Chemistry Dept. http://www.chem.uncc.edu >"These are my ideas and no one else will claim them." >"If you are not part of the solution, you are part of the precipitate" > Mary Ann Solstad, CIH 4 A's of Safety SOLSTAD Health & Safety Evaluations Attitude 16 Pequot Rd, Marblehead, MA 01945 Awareness 781-631-4748 tel, 781-631-1832 FAX Automatic Application Authority Past Chair, DivCHAS, ACS msolstad@mediaone.net ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 21:02:22 -0300 Reply-To: damar@wkve.com.br Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Damaris Silveira Duarte Subject: H3-tymidine MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Thank you for the replies. Dâmaris Silveira Duarte Centro de Ciências Exatas e Tecnológicas -CECET Universidade Vale do Rio Doce - UNIVALE rua Moreira Sales, 850, Vila Bretas Governador Valadares -Minas Gerais - Brasil CEP 35032-130 Tel: 55 033 2251717 ext.313 Fax: 55 033 2779861 e-mail: damaris@univale.br damar@wkve.com.br ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 07:59:56 EDT Reply-To: Labsafe@aol.com Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Labsafe@AOL.COM Subject: Safety Glasses MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subj: Safety Glasses Date: 99-04-07 11:27:15 EDT From: slane@fm.cnyric.org (Susan Lane) To: labsafe@aol.com I am a secretary in the Science office at Fayetteville-Manlius High School in Syracuse New York. One of the Chemistry teachers is looking for Bolle Chemical Splash Safety Glasses... Do you know the name of a company that distribute these. Thanks, Sue Lane Science Secretary (315)682-1266 If you can help, please respond directly to Ms. Lane. ... jim ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 08:01:52 -0400 Reply-To: lmz0@ms1.allencol.edu Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: lucy zotter Organization: allentown college Subject: College Chem Lab size MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi Everyone! My name is Lucy M. Zotter, I am CHO and chem lab manager fo Allentown College of Saint Francis De Sales in Center Valley PA. We are in the planning stages to build a new science building. Some of the planners want to put 24 students in a general chem lab with 1 instructor and no TA's or other help. I said that I did not think that this 24/1 ratio was safe. I was told to prove it. Help! If anyone has documentation or can tell me what other schools conside safe please send to me via e-mail ASAP. Thanks in Advance Lucy M. Zotter ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 11:13:00 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Nick Pinizzotto Subject: Lab Explosion at San Jose MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="openmail-part-05560243-00000001" --openmail-part-05560243-00000001 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; name="Lab" Content-Disposition: inline; filename="Lab" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Anyone Who has info on this please post it! Nick Pinizzotto Environmental Health Officer Dept. Environmental Health & Safety Thomas Jefferson University nick.pinizzotto@mail.tju.edu 215-503-5853 --openmail-part-05560243-00000001 Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 10:57:52 -0400 Content-Type: message/rfc822 Subject: Lab Explosion at San Jose MIME-Version: 1.0 Sender: Martha#f#Anderson/internet////////RFC-822/Martha#f#Anderson#a#mail#f#tju#f#edu@hpmail1 From: "Martha Anderson" TO: cherry.moragne@mail.tju.edu, jolene.shaw@mail.tju.edu, kate.ananson@mail.tju.edu, mary.b.o'connor@mail.tju.edu, nick.pinizzotto@mail.tju.edu, patrick.j.o'neill@mail.tju.edu, robert.shewbrooks@mail.tju.edu, stephanie.whitleigh@mail.tju.edu, stephen.baker@mail.tju.edu, susan.souder@mail.tju.edu Content-Type: multipart/Mixed; boundary="openmail-part-05560243-00000002" --openmail-part-05560243-00000002 Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 10:58:00 -0400 Content-Type: message/rfc822 Subject: Lab Explosion at San Jose MIME-Version: 1.0 Sender: Martha#f#Anderson/internet////////RFC-822/Martha#f#Anderson#a#mail#f#tju#f#edu@hpmail1 From: mdurham@LSU.EDU TO: SAFETY@LIST.UVM.EDU Content-Type: multipart/Mixed; boundary="openmail-part-05560243-00000003" --openmail-part-05560243-00000003 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline; filename="Lab" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Anyone on the list familiar with the lab explosion that sent several people to the hospital at San Jose State? There was a small writeup this morning in our local paper. Said a student put nitric acid in a beaker with ethanol residue in it. Mike Durham LSU --openmail-part-05560243-00000003-- --openmail-part-05560243-00000002-- --openmail-part-05560243-00000001-- ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 08:27:35 -0700 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Debbie Decker Subject: [SAFETY] Those who want to help - call 1-800-USAID-RELIEF Comments: To: mwcf@aecom.yu.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" With apologies for being slightly irresponsible by not checking this out before forwarding.... (and feeling an obligatory twinge of guilt for doing so). Debbie Decker UCDavis, EH&S dmdecker@ucdavis.edu >From: Mike Blazedell >Subject: [SAFETY] Those who want to help - call 1-800-USAID-RELIEF >To: SAFETY@LIST.UVM.EDU > >I thought I'd take a brief moment to pass this along -if every one that reads >this passes it on to someone they know it could reach millions in hours and >hopefully help .. The folks at USAID do a tremendous job all over the world, >to those that can help -thank you! > >Best and Safest Regards to each of you! >Mike Blazedell / Founder >http://www.WorldSafety.com >Mission: Helping Build a Safer, More Secure World. >===================================== >Subj: FEMA To Help With Kosovo Relief Effort >Date: 4/7/99 7:56:21 PM Eastern Daylight Time >From: eipa@fema.gov (Emergency Information Media Affairs) > >FEMA Establishes Donations Phone Bank for Humanitarian Relief for Kosovo >Refugees > >--High-level coordination underway between FEMA, USAID and DoD to ensure >effective delivery of assistance. > >Washington April 6, 1999 - The Federal Emergency Management Agency (FEMA) >has established a phone bank to handle public donations for relief >assistance for the Kosovar Albanian refugees, FEMA Director James Lee Witt >announced today, as he urged Americans who want to help to call >1-800-USAID-RELIEF. > >"Like all Americans, I am shocked by the conditions and the suffering that >the Albanian people are enduring," Witt said. "I'm sure that Americans all >across the country are anxious to help. At this time, we are asking for >cash donations only. Because of security and logistical concerns we are >not able to handle material goods. > >"FEMA has extensive experience in coordinating donations as well as the >deployment of supplies and equipment to help the victims of catastrophic >disasters," Witt said. "We are going to use that expertise to help the >Kosovo refugees." > >Meanwhile coordination meetings took place today at FEMA's Washington >headquarters following President Clinton's action on Monday naming >Director Witt to help coordinate humanitarian relief for the refugees. >Today's coordination meetings focused on ironing out procedures and >operational details for a massive humanitarian relief effort, named >Operation Sustain Hope by President Clinton. Brian Atwood, administrator >of the U.S. Agency for International Development, was named coordinator of >the overall effort. > >Witt said that he is sending a high-level team, which includes >FEMA's Deputy Director Mike Walker, to the NATO Mission in Brussels >Wednesday, April 7. Walker will be responsible for coordinating the >Agency's role in the relief effort with NATO and other organizations >involved in the rapidly growing humanitarian relief effort. > >The U.S. government has provided over $150 million in humanitarian >assistance to displaced Kosovars since February of last year, including a >provision of $50 million authorized by President Clinton on March 31. >President Clinton also ordered the prepositioning of humanitarian supplies >in the region well in advance of the current refugee crisis in preparation >for a variety of contingencies. In addition, the U.S. has stockpiled >enough food to feed 500,000 people for three months. > >Federal Emergency Management Agency (FEMA) >Office of Emergency Information & Public Affairs --- Washington, D.C. > >Information Available 24 hours a day . . . > ... on the World Wide Web: http://www.fema.gov > ... via fax-on-demand: phone in the U.S.A. (202) 646-FEMA (646-3362) > ... via digital audio for broadcasters & print: contact eipa@fema.gov > and listen to the FEMA Radio Network on the FEMA Website using RealAudio > > ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 09:13:08 -0700 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Larry Jeffryes Subject: Re: College Chem Lab size In-Reply-To: <370C9AB0.774A@email.allencol.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Thu, 8 Apr 1999, lucy zotter wrote: > I said that I did not think that this 24/1 ratio > was safe. I was told to prove it. Help! I, too, am interested in the "defense" or "proof." We (high school level) are in the process of building new chem labs (some of the first new buildings in a long time). The admin insists on labs for 30. If they only keep our labs at 24..that would be very nice. Most public school, I fear, are closer to 30/1, 35/1, and more.. -- _________________________________________________________________________ LARRY JEFFRYES LAHS Biology/ChemCom jeffryel@lahs.losalamos.k12.nm.us Los Alamos High School LOS ALAMOS, NEW MEXICO USA 505 672-9073 (HM) 505 663-2649 (SCHL) _________________________________________________________________________ ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 08:25:03 PST8PDT Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "Craig R. Burnett" Subject: Re: Lab Explosion at San Jose In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Published Thursday, April 8, 1999, in the San Jose Mercury News COMMUNITY IN BRIEF Students suffer minor injuries in explosion SAN JOSE -- Six San Jose State University students suffered minor injuries when chemicals being mixed in a science classroom exploded Wednesday. Five were taken to Santa Clara Valley Medical Center and treated for minor cuts and chemical exposure. The sixth was treated outside the basement laboratory in Duncan Hall. San Jose Fire Department's hazardous materials team sealed off the room to prevent fumes from spreading to the rest of the building, school officials said. The explosion occurred about 11:10 a.m. when a student mixed nitric acid and ethanol in a one-gallon jar. Those standing close by were showered with flying glass and spattered with the mixture, fire Capt. Rob Piper said. Craig R. Burnett Chemical Hygiene Officer Environmental Health & Safety California State University, Sacramento 6000 J Street Sacramento, CA 95819-6085 (916) 278-5165, (916) 278-4359 FAX E-mail: cburnett@csus.edu ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 11:59:20 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Amy Gregory Subject: 2,4-DNP Test Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Nacho Members, Our chemistry classes switched to new lab experiments 2 years ago. One of the experiments uses 2,4-DNP (2,4-Dinitrophenylhydrazine) to distinguish aldehydes and ketones from alcohols by forming a yellow precipitate with an aldehyde or a ketone. However, when I prepare the reagent, the yellow precipitate appears. The recipe that I have: 3.0 g of 2,4-DNP, 15 ml. of Sulfuric Acid, 75 ml. of 95% EtOH and 10 ml. of water. I thought that my problem might be occuring from the 1% of ketone added to the EtOH as indicated on the Fisher label. So, I tried MeOH, but that did not seem to make a difference. Does anyone else perform this test in their lab? Does it work? Is there another possible solvent to use in the reagent? I would appreciate any help you can offer! Thank you. Amy R. Gregory Lab Manager UC/Clermont College ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 11:31:50 -0600 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Benjamin Ruiz Loyola Organization: Fac. =?iso-8859-1?Q?Qu=EDmica?=, UNAM Subject: Re: 2,4-DNP Test MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Well, here in México we have no problem at all, because we distill the EtOH before preparing the reagent. Benjamín Ruiz Facultad de Química, UNAM. Amy Gregory wrote: > Nacho Members, > > Our chemistry classes switched to new lab experiments 2 years ago. One of > the experiments uses 2,4-DNP (2,4-Dinitrophenylhydrazine) to > distinguish aldehydes and ketones from alcohols by forming a yellow > precipitate with an aldehyde or a ketone. However, when I prepare the > reagent, the yellow precipitate appears. The recipe that I have: 3.0 g of > 2,4-DNP, 15 ml. of Sulfuric Acid, 75 ml. of 95% EtOH and 10 ml. of water. > I thought that my problem might be occuring from the 1% of ketone added to > the EtOH as indicated on the Fisher label. So, I tried MeOH, but that did > not seem to make a difference. Does anyone else perform this test in their > lab? Does it work? Is there another possible solvent to use in the > reagent? I would appreciate any help you can offer! > > Thank you. > > Amy R. Gregory > Lab Manager > UC/Clermont College ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 12:30:30 EDT Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Ilona Fiser Subject: Re: [SAFETY] Those who want to help - call 1-800-USAID-RELIEF In-Reply-To: <3.0.3.32.19990408082735.007bba50@scarlet.ucdavis.edu>; from "Debbie Decker" at Apr 8, 99 8:27 am And so you should, feel guilty! ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Carleton University Email address: ifiser@ccs.carleton.ca ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 11:34:15 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: PATRICIA BARKER Organization: Wabash College Subject: Re: 2,4-DNP Test In-Reply-To: <370CE806.AE03D9C7@servidor.unam.mx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Amy, My dnp is set up as follows: 24 gm 2,4 DNP 120 ml Sulfuric Acid 160 ml DI Water - copper free 560 ml 95% Ethanol Specifics for the recipe are : Mix the dnp and sulfuric acid mix seperately Copper free di and ethanol Combine solutions and mix Hope this helps. Pat ********************************************************************** Patricia Barker Barkerp@Wabash.edu Curator, Chemistry Department Phone 765-361-6207 Wabash College 301 West Wabash Ave Fax 765-361-6340 Crawfordsville, IN 47933 8:-) ********************************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 12:44:58 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Mary Ann Solstad Subject: Re: College Chem Lab size In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" As a former member of the ACS Committee on Chemical Safety, I recall discussions about this. The informal consensus was, 24 is max, 20 better -- unless the teacher always has a well-trained lab asst. (Cannot find this in my quickly scanned notes, though). 30 is an accident waiting to happen for 1 teacher. In any case, insist on good sight lines throughout the lab -- that will add a bit to safety. And keep traffic lanes away from hood fronts--that traffic will foul up ventilation systems. Try it (walking past hood face) while someone is holding a smoke tube--you'll quickly see what I mean. Are the administrators chemists? I doubt it. Mary Ann At 09:13 AM 4/8/99 -0700, you wrote: >On Thu, 8 Apr 1999, lucy zotter wrote: >> I said that I did not think that this 24/1 ratio >> was safe. I was told to prove it. Help! > >I, too, am interested in the "defense" or "proof." We (high school level) >are in the process of building new chem labs (some of the first new >buildings in a long time). The admin insists on labs for 30. If they >only keep our labs at 24..that would be very nice. > >Most public school, I fear, are closer to 30/1, 35/1, and more.. > >-- >_________________________________________________________________________ >LARRY JEFFRYES LAHS Biology/ChemCom > jeffryel@lahs.losalamos.k12.nm.us > Los Alamos High School > LOS ALAMOS, NEW MEXICO USA > 505 672-9073 (HM) 505 663-2649 (SCHL) >_________________________________________________________________________ > Mary Ann Solstad, CIH 4 A's of Safety SOLSTAD Health & Safety Evaluations Attitude 16 Pequot Rd, Marblehead, MA 01945 Awareness 781-631-4748 tel, 781-631-1832 FAX Automatic Application Authority Past Chair, DivCHAS, ACS msolstad@mediaone.net ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 10:44:46 -0600 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "Helen B. Gerhard" Subject: 2,4-DNP Test MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Hi All: Just remember...dry 2,4-DNP is highly explosive...make sure that it is kept moist in your storerooms. Thanks! Helen ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 10:47:14 -0600 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "Helen B. Gerhard" Subject: Re: [SAFETY] Those who want to help - call 1-800-USAID-RELIEF MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" A little harsh, don't you think. I feel that the apology should be simply accepted without comment. Thanks! Helen -----Original Message----- From: Ilona Fiser [SMTP:ifiser@CCS.CARLETON.CA] Sent: Thursday, April 08, 1999 10:31 AM To: LABSAFETY-L@SIU.EDU Subject: Re: [SAFETY] Those who want to help - call 1-800-USAID-RELIEF And so you should, feel guilty! ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Carleton University Email address: ifiser@ccs.carleton.ca ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 09:45:26 -0700 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Ernie Avery Subject: Re: 2,4-DNP Test In-Reply-To: <199904081552.LAA26363@newman.bch.uc.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Amy, Check the concentration of 2,4-DNP. 3.0 grams in a total of 100 ml. seems excessive.. At 11:59 AM 4/8/99 -0400, you wrote: >Nacho Members, > >Our chemistry classes switched to new lab experiments 2 years ago. One of >the experiments uses 2,4-DNP (2,4-Dinitrophenylhydrazine) to >distinguish aldehydes and ketones from alcohols by forming a yellow >precipitate with an aldehyde or a ketone. However, when I prepare the >reagent, the yellow precipitate appears. The recipe that I have: 3.0 g of >2,4-DNP, 15 ml. of Sulfuric Acid, 75 ml. of 95% EtOH and 10 ml. of water. >I thought that my problem might be occuring from the 1% of ketone added to >the EtOH as indicated on the Fisher label. So, I tried MeOH, but that did >not seem to make a difference. Does anyone else perform this test in their >lab? Does it work? Is there another possible solvent to use in the >reagent? I would appreciate any help you can offer! > >Thank you. > >Amy R. Gregory >Lab Manager >UC/Clermont College > > ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 12:46:49 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Barbara Ernisse Subject: Flame options needed In-Reply-To: <512FBC30EF@facmgmtserver.fm.csus.edu> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Hello, We are having a debate in our labs and I am asking for outside opinion and experience. Our STAT lab needs to use heat to fix stool slides. There are no natural gas lines in the Clinical labs and no one wants to install these lines. They estimate they may need to fix 2-5 slides weekly. The procedure calls for drying an aqueous based stain and fix mixture over a flame. The lab proposed purchasing an alcohol lamp. Another idea put forth was to use a butane fire-starter lighter. Does anyone out there have experience or strong, knowledgeable opinions on these options? I appreciate the list's assistance on this. As way of introduction, I have been silently observing and learning from the list from the inception of the list. My position is research laboratory safety in a large teaching hospital in an urban setting. Thanks Barb Ernisse ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 10:07:34 -0700 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Roberta Black Subject: Re: 2,4-DNP Test Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Amy--I had gobs of trouble with this too, until I used histological grade alcohol, i.e. VWR VW0470. Other manufacturers mayalso have it. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 12:39:55 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "L. James Stock III" <34EMQ6K@CMUVM.CSV.CMICH.EDU> Subject: Re: 2,4-DNP Test Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Your recipe is ok and your suspicions are correct. I use 100% pure ethyl alcohol from Pharmco Products Inc. 58 Vale Rd. Brookfiels, Connecticut 06804-3967 ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 14:07:26 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "Guy W. Innocente" Subject: Re: Flame options needed In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Hello Barb, There are electric heating trays designed for this. I was safety officer for several years in a teaching hospital. There were always problems in the Residents' labs. After we got the heating tray, the problems went down considerably. It will take slightly longer that using a flame, but the safety is worth it. I don't remember where we got these. Try some of the science supply companies. Good Luck Guy W. Innoocente =================================================================== At 12:46 PM 4/8/99 -0400, you wrote: >Hello, > >We are having a debate in our labs and I am asking for outside opinion and >experience. > >Our STAT lab needs to use heat to fix stool slides. There are no natural gas >lines in the Clinical labs and no one wants to install these lines. They >estimate they may need to fix 2-5 slides weekly. The procedure calls for drying >an aqueous based stain and fix mixture over a flame. > >The lab proposed purchasing an alcohol lamp. Another idea put forth was to use >a butane fire-starter lighter. Does anyone out there have experience or strong, >knowledgeable opinions on these options? > > >I appreciate the list's assistance on this. As way of introduction, I have been >silently observing and learning from the list from the inception of the list. >My position is research laboratory safety in a large teaching hospital in an >urban setting. > >Thanks >Barb Ernisse > > ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 13:39:19 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Katie Crysup Subject: Re: 2,4-DNP Test In-Reply-To: <199904081552.LAA26363@newman.bch.uc.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" We had the same problem with the denatured ethanol. We were able to get it to work with anhydrous ethanol. Methanol has different solublity properties and this may cause problems. Isopropanol may work. We now use the non-denatured ETOH since we obtained an alocohol user permit from the TABC, and it works fine. At 11:59 AM 4/8/99 -0400, you wrote: >Nacho Members, > >Our chemistry classes switched to new lab experiments 2 years ago. One of >the experiments uses 2,4-DNP (2,4-Dinitrophenylhydrazine) to >distinguish aldehydes and ketones from alcohols by forming a yellow >precipitate with an aldehyde or a ketone. However, when I prepare the >reagent, the yellow precipitate appears. The recipe that I have: 3.0 g of >2,4-DNP, 15 ml. of Sulfuric Acid, 75 ml. of 95% EtOH and 10 ml. of water. >I thought that my problem might be occuring from the 1% of ketone added to >the EtOH as indicated on the Fisher label. So, I tried MeOH, but that did >not seem to make a difference. Does anyone else perform this test in their >lab? Does it work? Is there another possible solvent to use in the >reagent? I would appreciate any help you can offer! > >Thank you. > >Amy R. Gregory >Lab Manager >UC/Clermont College > > Katie Crysup Chemistry Laboratory Coordinator Texas A&M University -- Corpus Christi 6300 Ocean Drive, CS 130 Corpus Christi, Tx 78412 361-994-5701 (O) 361-994-2742 (F) kcrysup@falcon.tamucc.edu **Area code change, 512 no longer valid after Sept 1999** ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 13:26:08 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Bill Schultz Subject: Re: Flame options needed MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit We use a portable Laboratory Burner made by Wall Lenk Corp. It consists of a 5.5 ounce can of butane with an adjustable burner that attaches to the can. Nomenclature: Lenk Model 65 Laboratory Burner Manufacturer: Wall Lenk Corp. 2300 Highway 11 North Kinston, NC 28501 Phone: 919-527-4186 Hope this helps. Bill Schultz ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Flame options needed Author: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List at Internet-Mail Date: 4/8/99 12:46 PM Hello, We are having a debate in our labs and I am asking for outside opinion and experience. Our STAT lab needs to use heat to fix stool slides. There are no natural gas lines in the Clinical labs and no one wants to install these lines. They estimate they may need to fix 2-5 slides weekly. The procedure calls for drying an aqueous based stain and fix mixture over a flame. The lab proposed purchasing an alcohol lamp. Another idea put forth was to use a butane fire-starter lighter. Does anyone out there have experience or strong, knowledgeable opinions on these options? I appreciate the list's assistance on this. As way of introduction, I have been silently observing and learning from the list from the inception of the list. My position is research laboratory safety in a large teaching hospital in an urban setting. Thanks Barb Ernisse ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 15:25:47 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Bob Burns Subject: Re: Flame options needed MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit WE use a propane torch, the kind you can get at any hardware store, for any flame requirements. ----- Original Message ----- From: Barbara Ernisse To: Sent: Thursday, April 08, 1999 12:46 Subject: Flame options needed > Hello, > > We are having a debate in our labs and I am asking for outside opinion and > experience. > > Our STAT lab needs to use heat to fix stool slides. There are no natural gas > lines in the Clinical labs and no one wants to install these lines. They > estimate they may need to fix 2-5 slides weekly. The procedure calls for drying > an aqueous based stain and fix mixture over a flame. > > The lab proposed purchasing an alcohol lamp. Another idea put forth was to use > a butane fire-starter lighter. Does anyone out there have experience or strong, > knowledgeable opinions on these options? > > > I appreciate the list's assistance on this. As way of introduction, I have been > silently observing and learning from the list from the inception of the list. > My position is research laboratory safety in a large teaching hospital in an > urban setting. > > Thanks > Barb Ernisse > > ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 13:44:20 -0700 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Larry Jeffryes Subject: Re: College Chem Lab size In-Reply-To: <3.0.3.32.19990408124458.00b94780@pop.ne.mediaone.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Thu, 8 Apr 1999, Mary Ann Solstad wrote: > Are the administrators chemists? I doubt it. > Unfortunately, they have the "power" to fill the void of regulations keepings sizes at 24/1 or 20/1.... -- _________________________________________________________________________ LARRY JEFFRYES LAHS Biology/ChemCom jeffryel@lahs.losalamos.k12.nm.us Los Alamos High School LOS ALAMOS, NEW MEXICO USA 505 672-9073 (HM) 505 663-2649 (SCHL) _________________________________________________________________________ ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 15:38:51 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Katie Crysup Subject: Re: Flame options needed In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" The new loop sterilizers have a place to put slides for fixation. At 12:46 PM 4/8/99 -0400, you wrote: >Hello, > >We are having a debate in our labs and I am asking for outside opinion and >experience. > >Our STAT lab needs to use heat to fix stool slides. There are no natural gas >lines in the Clinical labs and no one wants to install these lines. They >estimate they may need to fix 2-5 slides weekly. The procedure calls for drying >an aqueous based stain and fix mixture over a flame. > >The lab proposed purchasing an alcohol lamp. Another idea put forth was to use >a butane fire-starter lighter. Does anyone out there have experience or strong, >knowledgeable opinions on these options? > > >I appreciate the list's assistance on this. As way of introduction, I have been >silently observing and learning from the list from the inception of the list. >My position is research laboratory safety in a large teaching hospital in an >urban setting. > >Thanks >Barb Ernisse > > Katie Crysup Chemistry Laboratory Coordinator Texas A&M University -- Corpus Christi 6300 Ocean Drive, CS 130 Corpus Christi, Tx 78412 361-994-5701 (O) 361-994-2742 (F) kcrysup@falcon.tamucc.edu **Area code change, 512 no longer valid after Sept 1999** ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 13:21:28 -0700 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Becky Hoagland Subject: Another "Urban Legend"? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain One of our staffers just brought something to my attention that the group may be able to clarify. Seems an "official memo" (I question it's authenticity; it's not on official letterhead) went out from state personnel department director alerting employees to the presence of HIV-infected needles in public areas. The reported story involved a woman in a Dallas movie theater who sat on something sharp in one of the seats. "When she stood up to see what it was, a needle was found poking through the seat with an attached note saying, 'You have been infected with HIV.'" The memo goes on to say that "the Centers for Disease Control in Atlanta reports similar events have taken place in several other cities recently. All needles HAVE been positive for HIV. The CDC also reports that needles have been found in the coin return areas of pay phones and soda machines." Can anyone shed some light on this report?? Thanks in advance. Becky Hoagland Environmental Protection Specialist USDA-ARS P.O. Box 225 Stoneville, MS 38776 Phone: 601-686-5432 Fax: 601-686-5373 E-mail: hoaglanb@ars.usda.gov ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 15:43:13 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: PATRICIA BARKER Organization: Wabash College Subject: Re: Another "Urban Legend"? In-Reply-To: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Becky, From all I've heard this is another "urban legend". Pat Date sent: Thu, 08 Apr 1999 13:21:28 -0700 From: Becky Hoagland Subject: Another "Urban Legend"? To: LABSAFETY-L@SIU.EDU Send reply to: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List One of our staffers just brought something to my attention that the group may be able to clarify. Seems an "official memo" (I question it's authenticity; it's not on official letterhead) went out from state personnel department director alerting employees to the presence of HIV-infected needles in public areas. The reported story involved a woman in a Dallas movie theater who sat on something sharp in one of the seats. "When she stood up to see what it was, a needle was found poking through the seat with an attached note saying, 'You have been infected with HIV.'" The memo goes on to say that "the Centers for Disease Control in Atlanta reports similar events have taken place in several other cities recently. All needles HAVE been positive for HIV. The CDC also reports that needles have been found in the coin return areas of pay phones and soda machines." Can anyone shed some light on this report?? Thanks in advance. Becky Hoagland Environmental Protection Specialist USDA-ARS P.O. Box 225 Stoneville, MS 38776 Phone: 601-686-5432 Fax: 601-686-5373 E-mail: hoaglanb@ars.usda.gov ********************************************************************** Patricia Barker Barkerp@Wabash.edu Curator, Chemistry Department Phone 765-361-6207 Wabash College 301 West Wabash Ave Fax 765-361-6340 Crawfordsville, IN 47933 8:-) ********************************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 16:40:00 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "Tayman, Tammy" Subject: Re: Another "Urban Legend"? Comments: To: Becky Hoagland MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Check out a few of the web sites relating to urban legends. Yes, this is one of them. One version even attributes itself to a press release from the CDC. Of course, when asked, the CDC doesn't know anything about it. Web sites to check: http://urbanlegends.miningco.com/library/weekly/aa100798.htm http://www.cdc.gov/nchstp/hiv_aids/pubs/faq/faq5a.htm Tammy Tayman ---------- From: Becky Hoagland To: LABSAFETY-L@SIU.EDU Subject: Another "Urban Legend"? Date: Thursday, April 08, 1999 4:21PM One of our staffers just brought something to my attention that the group may be able to clarify. Seems an "official memo" (I question it's authenticity; it's not on official letterhead) went out from state personnel department director alerting employees to the presence of HIV-infected needles in public areas. The reported story involved a woman in a Dallas movie theater who sat on something sharp in one of the seats. "When she stood up to see what it was, a needle was found poking through the seat with an attached note saying, 'You have been infected with HIV.'" The memo goes on to say that "the Centers for Disease Control in Atlanta reports similar events have taken place in several other cities recently. All needles HAVE been positive for HIV. The CDC also reports that needles have been found in the coin return areas of pay phones and soda machines." Can anyone shed some light on this report?? Thanks in advance. Becky Hoagland Environmental Protection Specialist USDA-ARS P.O. Box 225 Stoneville, MS 38776 Phone: 601-686-5432 Fax: 601-686-5373 E-mail: hoaglanb@ars.usda.gov ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 16:53:43 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Madelyn Miller Subject: Re: Another "Urban Legend"? In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Greetings Allow me to put a stop to this one right now. I called the CDC in Atlanta, HIV section and they say this is a hoax!!! There have been NO substantiated reports of any incidents like this. Whenever you get urban legends like this call the "source" and find out if it is true rather than perpetuating it. I also called the American Cancer Society who has a web page on the email chain letter. If you do call CDC as I did you will get a long groan about this story. Madelyn On Thu, 8 Apr 1999 13:21:28 -0700 Becky Hoagland wrote: > One of our staffers just brought something to my attention that the group > may be able to clarify. Seems an "official memo" (I question it's > authenticity; it's not on official letterhead) went out from state personnel > department director alerting employees to the presence of HIV-infected > needles in public areas. The reported story involved a woman in a Dallas > movie theater who sat on something sharp in one of the seats. "When > she stood up to see what it was, a needle was found poking through the > seat with an attached note saying, 'You have been infected with HIV.'" > The memo goes on to say that "the Centers for Disease Control in Atlanta > reports similar events have taken place in several other cities recently. > All needles HAVE been positive for HIV. The CDC also reports that > needles have been found in the coin return areas of pay phones and > soda machines." > > Can anyone shed some light on this report?? > > Thanks in advance. > > Becky Hoagland > Environmental Protection Specialist > USDA-ARS > P.O. Box 225 > Stoneville, MS 38776 > Phone: 601-686-5432 > Fax: 601-686-5373 > E-mail: hoaglanb@ars.usda.gov ---------------------- Madelyn Miller Chemical Hygiene Officer, CCHO Environmental Health & Safety Carnegie Mellon University mmiller@andrew.cmu.edu ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 16:11:05 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: daustin Subject: Re: Another "Urban Legend"? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi Becky, This morning, on CNN, it was reported, by Atlanta Disease Control pubicly and stated that there is no credibility to any of this stuff. A. phone change slots, B needles in movie seats.. Unfortunately now we probaly will hear about the sick o that has gotten the idea and gone out and done such a terrible thing. Dave Austin, Sr. ES&H Offr. ----- Original Message ----- From: Becky Hoagland To: Sent: Thursday, April 08, 1999 15:21 Subject: Another "Urban Legend"? : One of our staffers just brought something to my attention that the group : may be able to clarify. Seems an "official memo" (I question it's : authenticity; it's not on official letterhead) went out from state personnel : department director alerting employees to the presence of HIV-infected : needles in public areas. The reported story involved a woman in a Dallas : movie theater who sat on something sharp in one of the seats. "When : she stood up to see what it was, a needle was found poking through the : seat with an attached note saying, 'You have been infected with HIV.'" : The memo goes on to say that "the Centers for Disease Control in Atlanta : reports similar events have taken place in several other cities recently. : All needles HAVE been positive for HIV. The CDC also reports that : needles have been found in the coin return areas of pay phones and : soda machines." : : Can anyone shed some light on this report?? : : Thanks in advance. : : Becky Hoagland : Environmental Protection Specialist : USDA-ARS : P.O. Box 225 : Stoneville, MS 38776 : Phone: 601-686-5432 : Fax: 601-686-5373 : E-mail: hoaglanb@ars.usda.gov ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 10:03:12 +1000 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "Prof. B. Ternai" Subject: Student/staff ratio Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" The principle of laboratory supervision in a teaching environment is that the supervisor MUST be able to see all the students under his/her care at all times. Therefore the number of students which can be safely supervised might vary with the geometry of the arrangement of the laboratory benches, fumehoods and other furniture. However, there is still an upper limit for the student/supervisor ratio, since the supervisor must be able to EFFECTIVELY control the actions of the students under his/her care. This restricts the distance between the supervisor and any one student such that the effective ratio , in practice, is usually about 12 to 16 students for each supervisor. In addition, there MUST be a competent staff member present in charge of each laboratory to supervise the student supervisors. There is almost always a tendency of the administration to reduce the financial support for TAs. However, if the Department or Faculty will point out the very real danger of serious financial penalties inposed if this principle is not followed and there is an injury, common sense always prevail. (At least, it did at those Universities I have been in Australia, the US and elsewhere.) ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 17:27:05 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: purflece Subject: Re: College Chem Lab size MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Go to the NSTA website (National Science Teacher's Association) where they have guidelines. The number they use is 24 per lab as being the national target in High Schools. Once you get above that number, even with a large lab, oversight gets to be an issue and most of us have never seen a TA!. If oversight is an issue, then safety is compromised. The number of 24 is in a lot of state guidelines which could put a school is jeopardy on liability in the event there is an accident and the class size is above 24. Richard Boosey Bigelow High School Purrfleece Farms purflece@alltel.net ---------- > From: Larry Jeffryes > To: LABSAFETY-L@SIU.EDU > Subject: Re: College Chem Lab size > Date: Thursday, April 08, 1999 11:13 AM > > On Thu, 8 Apr 1999, lucy zotter wrote: > > I said that I did not think that this 24/1 ratio > > was safe. I was told to prove it. Help! > > I, too, am interested in the "defense" or "proof." We (high school level) > are in the process of building new chem labs (some of the first new > buildings in a long time). The admin insists on labs for 30. If they > only keep our labs at 24..that would be very nice. > > Most public school, I fear, are closer to 30/1, 35/1, and more.. > > -- > _________________________________________________________________________ > LARRY JEFFRYES LAHS Biology/ChemCom > jeffryel@lahs.losalamos.k12.nm.us > Los Alamos High School > LOS ALAMOS, NEW MEXICO USA > 505 672-9073 (HM) 505 663-2649 (SCHL) > _________________________________________________________________________ ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 09:41:25 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Janeen LaPierre Subject: Re: Student/staff ratio Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Hi all. It sure has been a busy week here. We are in the midst of Bacteriology lab for the first year med students. How does 56:1 sound to you for a student:teacher ratio? It is absolutely insane! But that's what I'm dealing with right now. Prof. Ternai makes many good points in this recent e-mail posting and I especially love the 12 to 16 students per instructor. I have had the pleasure of working with small upper level undergraduate labs with only 10 to 15 students in them. We were able to do some really neat stuff and the students told me they learned more in lab about genetics than they did in the lecture portion of the course. Unfortunately, these decisions are not always made by educators who have actually taught students in the lab setting. They are more concerned with FTE's(money) than educational and safety considerations. I must say that this is an unfortunate trend and I for one would like to see some very stringent guidelines put in place for all educational settings in this regard. All administrators are not so graced with common sense as we would like to think. Well, I'll hop off the soap box now. Hope you all have a great weekend, Janeen. ***************** Janeen Lapierre, CHO College of Osteopathic Medicine University of New England 11 Hills Beach Road Biddeford, ME 04005 E-Mail: JLaPierre@MAILBOX.UNE.EDU Phone: (207) 283-0170 ext 2446 Opinions are mine and not those of UNE. >>> "Prof. B. Ternai" - 4/8/99 8:03 PM >>> The principle of laboratory supervision in a teaching environment is that the supervisor MUST be able to see all the students under his/her care at all times. Therefore the number of students which can be safely supervised might vary with the geometry of the arrangement of the laboratory benches, fumehoods and other furniture. However, there is still an upper limit for the student/supervisor ratio, since the supervisor must be able to EFFECTIVELY control the actions of the students under his/her care. This restricts the distance between the supervisor and any one student such that the effective ratio , in practice, is usually about 12 to 16 students for each supervisor. In addition, there MUST be a competent staff member present in charge of each laboratory to supervise the student supervisors. snip>>>> ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 10:12:35 -0400 Reply-To: "edmiston@bluffton.edu" Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Michael Edmiston Organization: Bluffton College Subject: College Chem Lab Size MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I believe Professor Ternai is exactly correct about lines of sight, proximity, etc. More important, I like his use of the word EFFECTIVE and I would like to expand on it. One aspect of being effective is being safe. In this regard we operate, and we have seen others operate, on the basis that a lab size can be as large as 24 students, but there must be two supervisors once the size is over 12. (I have seen others use 15 for this number.) One supervisor is a regular staff member (professor/teacher) and the other is a TA or student assistant. Although it is clear some people assume that the 24 limit suggested by ACS is with one supervisor, it is clear many schools use two supervisors for 24 students, perhaps partly for the reason described in the next paragraph. The second aspect of effective (and we feel this is just as important) is making sure the students have a good educational experience. Are they getting a good interaction with a competent lab professional to answer their questions and to have the lab techniques observed and critiqued. We think this requires a ratio of about 12:1. At Bluffton College, with no graduate program, we have zero TA's. We have also found it difficult to rely on undergraduate lab assistants because they rarely have time they can schedule to be present for a two or three hour lab (unless it's their own lab). Therefore we only use professors, and we follow a 12:1 rule. Occasionally the freshman chemistry instructor has used a junior/senior chemistry student to help even with a 12-student lab. He got worried about spending so much time with one or two students that he was not always observing what happened behind his back. So he wanted a good chemistry student present to watch over the whole group while he was spending time answering the questions of one or a few. That enabled him to be very effective in the second meaning of "effective" as described above. Finally, let me point out a very interesting point that ought to have some weight with administrators at least in colleges. Most colleges advertise their student faculty ratio, and brag if it is low. A quick survey of the top colleges in the "US News and World Report" rankings of college shows that the best ranked colleges have student/faculty ratios around 10:1, and they boldly advertise that. As you go down in the rankings, the ratio climbs: 12:1 15:1, 18:1, etc. But even at some large state-supported universities the ratio is advertised at less than 18:1. So here's the point... In a lab experience, when so much is at stake both safety-wise and educationally-wise, how can a school sanction a 24:1 (or worse) lab ratio when they brag about an overall faculty student ratio of 10 or 12 or 15 to one? The answer is that they can't. And the good schools don't. The good schools have a 12:1 or 15:1 ratio in lab just like the ratio for the college as a whole. It is true that student/faculty ratios in public schools is higher. I believe our state requires a class-size average of no more than 24:1... although this is an average. But how could you justify that the intense atmosphere of a lab could possibly be one of the classes that exceeds the average? Michael D. Edmiston, Ph.D. Phone/voice-mail: 419-358-3270 Professor of Chemistry & Physics FAX: 419-358-3323 Chairman, Science Department E-Mail edmiston@bluffton.edu Bluffton College 280 West College Avenue Bluffton, OH 45817 ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 10:18:22 -0700 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Susan Fox Organization: Christopher Newport University Subject: Chem class size MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------65B5BDDA960F3E6E11A1D42A" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------65B5BDDA960F3E6E11A1D42A Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit We are a small State University. Our introductory and general chemistry laboratories are routinely set up for no more than 24 students, with one instructor and no assistant. So far, so good. It appears to be manageable. Susan Fox --------------65B5BDDA960F3E6E11A1D42A Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=us-ascii; name="vcard.vcf" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: Card for Susan Fox Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="vcard.vcf" begin: vcard fn: Susan Fox n: Fox;Susan org: Christopher Newport University adr: One University Place;;Biology Department;Newport News;VA;23606;USA email;internet: sfox@cnu.edu title: Laboratory Specialist tel;work: 757-594-7280 tel;fax: 757-594-7919 x-mozilla-cpt: ;0 x-mozilla-html: FALSE version: 2.1 end: vcard --------------65B5BDDA960F3E6E11A1D42A-- ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 11:13:11 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Dewey Williams Subject: Re: College Chem Lab Size In-Reply-To: <01BE8271.7DEC3520.edmiston@bluffton.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed At our school, our 1st and 2nd year chemistry labs have 32 students!!!! In most of the 1st year labs, they are taught by a graduate student (MS). Our 2nd year courses (Organic Chemistry) are taught by one faculty and an undergraduate LA. Our 3rd, 4th and graduate level classes are limited to 24 or less. Over the years, administration has been informed that this enrollment level is unsafe and unusual for chemistry labs. No changes have been made to lower the enrollment in these labs, however. Dewey Williams - Lab Manager mailto:williams@email.uncc.edu UNC-Charlotte Chemistry Dept. http://www.chem.uncc.edu "These are my ideas and no one else will claim them." "If you are not part of the solution, you are part of the precipitate" ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 12:10:09 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Patricia DePra Subject: Re: College Chem Lab size I am surprised at the 24/1 ratio being max. When I did an informal survey a year ago, (admittedly with a relatively small sample, looking only at 4-year college/university level) I found nothing that high. That's assuming that ta's are counted as instructors. --Patricia DePra Westfield State College ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 12:08:41 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Gian Hofer Subject: Merc Thermometer Broken MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Minor Emergency! A mercury thermometer just broke in the lab. Technician was picking up the pieces with hands! What is the procedure? How to clean up/dispose. Your assistance is appreciated. Gian Hofer Regulatory Affairs Specialist Raisio Chemicals Canada, Inc. raisio@nas.net 905 331 0950/905331 0943 fax ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 12:48:44 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "Henry Boyter Jr." Subject: Re: Merc Thermometer Broken MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Use the mercury spill kit you should have in the lab. Start by vacuuming up the larger drops with an aspirator source and small pipet. For the rest, treat with sulfur and sweep up. There are other modern things to use other than sulfur, but you may not have them. Put all in a container for disposal. Remember, gloves, goggles, etc. Make sure there is ventillation. Dr. Henry Boyter, Jr. Ph.D. Chemist The opinions of Dr. Boyter are provided for informational purposes only and should not be used as advice. No warranty or expression of professionalism is implied. *************** -----Original Message----- From: Gian Hofer To: LABSAFETY-L@SIU.EDU Date: Friday, April 09, 1999 12:09 PM Subject: Merc Thermometer Broken Minor Emergency! A mercury thermometer just broke in the lab. Technician was picking up the pieces with hands! What is the procedure? How to clean up/dispose. Your assistance is appreciated. Gian Hofer Regulatory Affairs Specialist Raisio Chemicals Canada, Inc. raisio@nas.net 905 331 0950/905331 0943 fax ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 12:45:41 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Susan Souder Subject: Another "Urban Legend" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To all members, This urban legend has already been on another list and you may check out CDC's response by looking at website: http://www.cdc.gov/nchstp/hiv_aids/pubs/faq/faq5a.htm Susan Souder, M.S., MT(ASCP) Biological Safety Officer Thomas Jefferson University Phila., Pa. 19107 215-503-7422 ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 13:01:18 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Bob Burns Subject: Re: Merc Thermometer Broken MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Get a mercury spill kit. It has everything you need. Fisher Scientific has several in their safety catalog. other lab supply houses probably do to. Call your lab supply people. ----- Original Message ----- From: Gian Hofer To: Sent: Friday, April 09, 1999 13:08 Subject: Merc Thermometer Broken > Minor Emergency! > A mercury thermometer just broke in the lab. Technician was picking up > the pieces with hands! > > What is the procedure? How to clean up/dispose. > > Your assistance is appreciated. > > Gian Hofer > Regulatory Affairs Specialist > > Raisio Chemicals Canada, Inc. > raisio@nas.net > > 905 331 0950/905331 0943 fax > > ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 13:03:42 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "David C. Finster" Organization: Wittenberg University Subject: Re: Merc Thermometer Broken MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > For the rest [of the Hg droplets], treat with sulfur and sweep up. > There are other modern things to use other than sulfur, but > you may not have them. Put all in a container for disposal. > Remember, gloves, goggles, etc. Make sure there is ventillation. With regard to using sulfur on a Hg spill, Prudent Practices says: "The common practice of using sulfur should be discontinued because the practice is ineffective and the resulting waste creates a disposal problem." (page 89) PP recommends using the spill kit, which allows for Hg reclamation. Dave -- David C. Finster Professor and Chair of Chemistry University Chemical Hygiene Officer 937-327-6441 dfinster@wittenberg.edu http://userpages.wittenberg.edu/dfinster/ ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 12:30:11 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Katie Crysup Subject: Re: Merc Thermometer Broken In-Reply-To: <370E3419.4313CEE0@nas.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Use nitril gloves, don't let near heat or will emit Mercury gas. Put powdered sulfur on the spill all around area and sweep up into labled waste container, put all contents including glass into same container. Have proper waste disposal company pick up. At 12:08 PM 4/9/99 -0500, you wrote: >Minor Emergency! >A mercury thermometer just broke in the lab. Technician was picking up >the pieces with hands! > >What is the procedure? How to clean up/dispose. > >Your assistance is appreciated. > >Gian Hofer >Regulatory Affairs Specialist > >Raisio Chemicals Canada, Inc. >raisio@nas.net > >905 331 0950/905331 0943 fax > > Katie Crysup Chemistry Laboratory Coordinator Texas A&M University -- Corpus Christi 6300 Ocean Drive, CS 130 Corpus Christi, Tx 78412 361-994-5701 (O) 361-994-2742 (F) kcrysup@falcon.tamucc.edu **Area code change, 512 no longer valid after Sept 1999** ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 14:01:27 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Mary Ann Solstad Subject: Re: Merc Thermometer Broken In-Reply-To: <001c01be82a8$d55cd4e0$deb9b5c6@dellv350> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I second Boyter's suggestion, but I'm guessing you do not have a Hg spill kit. In any case the vacuum he mentions is not regular or even HEPA--they would just disperse Hg vapor more effectively. The old aspirator bottle, (run by water power, with a trap) rubber hose and pipet tip will help. The glass can be picked up with two index cards, and don't forget leather gloves for the glass bit. "Flowers" of sulfur dusted in the area will help. Then wipe all surfaces, including vertical nearby, with a damp towel. Dispose of all in heavy plastic bag, seal and mark as Hg waste. Good idea to wear shoe covering--even a plastic bag--in the area. Shoes can spread Hg pretty fast. And ventilate as Boyter reminds us. Mary Ann At 12:48 PM 4/9/99 -0400, you wrote: >Use the mercury spill kit you should have in the lab. >Start by vacuuming up the larger drops with an aspirator source >and small pipet. For the rest, treat with sulfur and sweep up. >There are other modern things to use other than sulfur, but >you may not have them. Put all in a container for disposal. >Remember, gloves, goggles, etc. Make sure there is ventillation. > >Dr. Henry Boyter, Jr. Ph.D. Chemist > >The opinions of Dr. Boyter are provided for informational >purposes only and should not be used as advice. No >warranty or expression of professionalism is implied. > >*************** > > > >-----Original Message----- >From: Gian Hofer >To: LABSAFETY-L@SIU.EDU >Date: Friday, April 09, 1999 12:09 PM >Subject: Merc Thermometer Broken > > >Minor Emergency! >A mercury thermometer just broke in the lab. Technician was picking up >the pieces with hands! > >What is the procedure? How to clean up/dispose. > >Your assistance is appreciated. > >Gian Hofer >Regulatory Affairs Specialist > >Raisio Chemicals Canada, Inc. >raisio@nas.net > >905 331 0950/905331 0943 fax > Mary Ann Solstad, CIH 4 A's of Safety SOLSTAD Health & Safety Evaluations Attitude 16 Pequot Rd, Marblehead, MA 01945 Awareness 781-631-4748 tel, 781-631-1832 FAX Automatic Application Authority Past Chair, DivCHAS, ACS msolstad@mediaone.net ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 14:34:33 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Don Abramowitz Subject: Re: Merc Thermometer Broken In-Reply-To: <370E32ED.8175A6D9@wittenberg.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >With regard to using sulfur on a Hg spill, Prudent Practices says: "The >common practice of using sulfur should be discontinued because the practice >is ineffective and the resulting waste creates a disposal problem." (page >89) Instead of sulfur, zinc shavings makes an effective "sweeping compound" for picking up surface contamination too small for the pipette/vacuum. It works best on fresh spills - it forms an amalgam with the mercury. It's often sold by the jar in the catalogs alongside the Hg spill kits, usually with a bit of citric acid mixed in. It's meant to be used dampened with water, and I've found it effective. Disposal is still a problem. We containerize it and send it off as mercury waste, one of our most expensive waste streams. Lastly, there is a product called "Merconvap", a liquid meant to be sprayed on surfaces after clean-up to reduce the volatility of any remaining mercury. It contains a glycol (not sure if it's ethylene or propylene) and a sulfur compound to form a non-volatile coating on microdroplets. Good for cracks between tiles, along baseboards etc. Not recommended for spraying larger floor areas - it's quite slippery. I realize these aren't items you'll likely have on the shelf, but something to consider in stocking your spill kit. Don ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Donald Abramowitz, CIH Occupational and Environmental Safety Officer Bryn Mawr College | Swarthmore College 101 N. Merion Avenue | 500 College Avenue Bryn Mawr, PA 19010 | Swarthmore PA 19081 ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 13:53:54 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "Rebecca Levins, RSR Corporation" Subject: Re: Merc Thermometer Broken MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="---- =_NextPart_000_01BE8290.D5A64DE0" ------ =_NextPart_000_01BE8290.D5A64DE0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit What if, like in this case, they cannot wait to get a spill kit? What is in the spill kit that cleans up the mercury? Thank you, Rebecca Levins Environmental Health & Safety Compliance Specialist RSR Corporation Dallas, Texas RSRrdl@onramp.net (214) 583-0245 -----Original Message----- From: David C. Finster [SMTP:dfinster@WITTENBERG.EDU] Sent: Friday, April 09, 1999 12:04 PM To: LABSAFETY-L@SIU.EDU Subject: Re: Merc Thermometer Broken > For the rest [of the Hg droplets], treat with sulfur and sweep up. > There are other modern things to use other than sulfur, but > you may not have them. Put all in a container for disposal. > Remember, gloves, goggles, etc. Make sure there is ventillation. With regard to using sulfur on a Hg spill, Prudent Practices says: "The common practice of using sulfur should be discontinued because the practice is ineffective and the resulting waste creates a disposal problem." (page 89) PP recommends using the spill kit, which allows for Hg reclamation. Dave -- David C. Finster Professor and Chair of Chemistry University Chemical Hygiene Officer 937-327-6441 dfinster@wittenberg.edu http://userpages.wittenberg.edu/dfinster/ ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 13:06:21 -0600 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "Greene, Ben" Subject: Re: Merc Thermometer Broken MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain I like this discussion. I have seen a spill kit for mercury equipped with a container of lead shot for amalgamating. I don't believe I would choose this route; the idea of chasing mercury with an excess of lead, then having lead all over the floor just doesn't appeal. Don't forget the excess of lead would lead you to a lead clean up. The spill kit does contain a scrubbing cloth which contains zinc. I would use that to wipe down residual contamination I could not aspirate. Be careful with your zinc (make sure it is a shaving not a powder) and keep ignition sources away. Zinc fires can be quite exciting but you wouldn't want to have one while cleaning up mercury. Zinc powder can also be pyrophoric. Ben > >With regard to using sulfur on a Hg spill, Prudent Practices says: > "The > >common practice of using sulfur should be discontinued because the > practice > >is ineffective and the resulting waste creates a disposal problem." > (page > >89) > > Instead of sulfur, zinc shavings makes an effective "sweeping > compound" > for picking up surface contamination too small for the pipette/vacuum. > It > works best on fresh spills - it forms an amalgam with the mercury. > It's > often sold by the jar in the catalogs alongside the Hg spill kits, > usually > with a bit of citric acid mixed in. It's meant to be used dampened > with > water, and I've found it effective. > > Disposal is still a problem. We containerize it and send it off as > mercury > waste, one of our most expensive waste streams. > > Lastly, there is a product called "Merconvap", a liquid meant to be > sprayed > on surfaces after clean-up to reduce the volatility of any remaining > mercury. It contains a glycol (not sure if it's ethylene or > propylene) and > a sulfur compound to form a non-volatile coating on microdroplets. > Good > for cracks between tiles, along baseboards etc. Not recommended for > spraying larger floor areas - it's quite slippery. > > I realize these aren't items you'll likely have on the shelf, but > something > to consider in stocking your spill kit. > > Don > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > ~~~~~~~ > Donald Abramowitz, CIH > Occupational and Environmental Safety Officer > > Bryn Mawr College | Swarthmore College > 101 N. Merion Avenue | 500 College Avenue > Bryn Mawr, PA 19010 | Swarthmore PA 19081 > ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 15:27:25 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "Henry Boyter Jr." Subject: Re: Merc Thermometer Broken MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I like this also. It is a very informative back and forth. Besides, where else can you use the expression "..lead would lead you to a lead clean up." Say that five times fast. Dr. Henry Boyter, Jr. Ph.D. Chemist The opinions of Dr. Boyter are provided for informational purposes only and should not be used as advice. No warranty or expression of professionalism is implied. *************** -----Original Message----- From: Greene, Ben To: LABSAFETY-L@SIU.EDU Date: Friday, April 09, 1999 3:00 PM Subject: Re: Merc Thermometer Broken I like this discussion. I have seen a spill kit for mercury equipped with a container of lead shot for amalgamating. I don't believe I would choose this route; the idea of chasing mercury with an excess of lead, then having lead all over the floor just doesn't appeal. Don't forget the excess of lead would lead you to a lead clean up. The spill kit does contain a scrubbing cloth which contains zinc. I would use that to wipe down residual contamination I could not aspirate. Be careful with your zinc (make sure it is a shaving not a powder) and keep ignition sources away. Zinc fires can be quite exciting but you wouldn't want to have one while cleaning up mercury. Zinc powder can also be pyrophoric. Ben > >With regard to using sulfur on a Hg spill, Prudent Practices says: > "The > >common practice of using sulfur should be discontinued because the > practice > >is ineffective and the resulting waste creates a disposal problem." > (page > >89) > > Instead of sulfur, zinc shavings makes an effective "sweeping > compound" > for picking up surface contamination too small for the pipette/vacuum. > It > works best on fresh spills - it forms an amalgam with the mercury. > It's > often sold by the jar in the catalogs alongside the Hg spill kits, > usually > with a bit of citric acid mixed in. It's meant to be used dampened > with > water, and I've found it effective. > > Disposal is still a problem. We containerize it and send it off as > mercury > waste, one of our most expensive waste streams. > > Lastly, there is a product called "Merconvap", a liquid meant to be > sprayed > on surfaces after clean-up to reduce the volatility of any remaining > mercury. It contains a glycol (not sure if it's ethylene or > propylene) and > a sulfur compound to form a non-volatile coating on microdroplets. > Good > for cracks between tiles, along baseboards etc. Not recommended for > spraying larger floor areas - it's quite slippery. > > I realize these aren't items you'll likely have on the shelf, but > something > to consider in stocking your spill kit. > > Don > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > ~~~~~~~ > Donald Abramowitz, CIH > Occupational and Environmental Safety Officer > > Bryn Mawr College | Swarthmore College > 101 N. Merion Avenue | 500 College Avenue > Bryn Mawr, PA 19010 | Swarthmore PA 19081 > ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 15:27:11 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Bob Burns Subject: Re: Merc Thermometer Broken MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Zinc. it forms an amalgam which can be cleaned up and disposed of. ----- Original Message ----- From: Rebecca Levins, RSR Corporation To: Sent: Friday, April 09, 1999 14:53 Subject: Re: Merc Thermometer Broken > What if, like in this case, they cannot wait to get a spill kit? What is in the spill kit that cleans up the mercury? > > Thank you, > > Rebecca Levins > Environmental Health & Safety Compliance Specialist > RSR Corporation > Dallas, Texas > > RSRrdl@onramp.net > (214) 583-0245 > > > -----Original Message----- > From: David C. Finster [SMTP:dfinster@WITTENBERG.EDU] > Sent: Friday, April 09, 1999 12:04 PM > To: LABSAFETY-L@SIU.EDU > Subject: Re: Merc Thermometer Broken > > > For the rest [of the Hg droplets], treat with sulfur and sweep up. > > There are other modern things to use other than sulfur, but > > you may not have them. Put all in a container for disposal. > > Remember, gloves, goggles, etc. Make sure there is ventillation. > > With regard to using sulfur on a Hg spill, Prudent Practices says: "The > common practice of using sulfur should be discontinued because the practice > is ineffective and the resulting waste creates a disposal problem." (page > 89) > > PP recommends using the spill kit, which allows for Hg reclamation. > > Dave > > -- > David C. Finster > Professor and Chair of Chemistry > University Chemical Hygiene Officer > 937-327-6441 > dfinster@wittenberg.edu > http://userpages.wittenberg.edu/dfinster/ > ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 15:47:42 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Naomi Kelly Subject: Re: Merc Thermometer Broken In-Reply-To: <3.0.1.16.19990409122515.3abfaa26@falcon.tamucc.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" A spill kit for mercury should be used--"sulfur is ineffective and the resulting waste creates a disposal problem" (Prudent Practices). If you don't presently have mercury spill kits, you should get them, but you can use wet towels or adhesive tape to pick up the droplets; then place into a thick-wall high-density polyethylene bottle. Contact your hazardous waste team for disposal. Exposed work surfaces and floors should then be decontaminated by using an appropriate decontamination kit. At 12:30 PM 4/9/99 -0500, you wrote: >Use nitril gloves, don't let near heat or will emit Mercury gas. Put >powdered sulfur on the spill all around area and sweep up into labled waste >container, put all contents including glass into same container. Have >proper waste disposal company pick up. > >At 12:08 PM 4/9/99 -0500, you wrote: >>Minor Emergency! >>A mercury thermometer just broke in the lab. Technician was picking up >>the pieces with hands! >> >>What is the procedure? How to clean up/dispose. >> >>Your assistance is appreciated. >> >>Gian Hofer >>Regulatory Affairs Specialist >> >>Raisio Chemicals Canada, Inc. >>raisio@nas.net >> >>905 331 0950/905331 0943 fax >> >> >Katie Crysup >Chemistry Laboratory Coordinator >Texas A&M University -- Corpus Christi >6300 Ocean Drive, CS 130 >Corpus Christi, Tx 78412 >361-994-5701 (O) >361-994-2742 (F) >kcrysup@falcon.tamucc.edu >**Area code change, 512 no longer valid after Sept 1999** ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 06:14:30 -0700 Reply-To: Marc Neuffer Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Marc Neuffer Organization: SafetyInfo.Com Subject: OSHA Lost Battle MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit OSHA has (temporarily?) lost the battle for their "Cooperative Compliance Program" http://www.safetyinfo.com Click on 12 April Safety News for more on this story Just added - free Accident Investigation Power Point Presentation Now over 700 web pages of free safety information Regards Marc Neuffer Safety Info.Com ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 08:01:33 -0700 Reply-To: aschuetze@edgewood-sa.k12.tx.us Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Andrew Schuetze Organization: Math & Science Academy Subject: Ducted Chemical Storage cabinets MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Howdy, I teach chemistry in a small building and my chemical storage is located in my equipment storage room. I am looking for chemical storage cabinets that have a 24 hour/365 day ducted ventilation. ie I want cabinets with doors that can beconnected to an exhaust system. My chemical inventory is not large and 4 or 5 six foot tall cabinets would suffice. This way I can reduce the deterioration of electronic equipment such as balances and spec20's from Iodine vapors and the like. Can anyone offer suggestions for suppliers of such cabinetry? Thanks, APS -- .-.M .-.S .-.A .-. .-. .-. / \A / \C E/ \C Y/ \ / \ / \ .T &. .I C. .A M. . . . . . \H / \E N/ \D E/ \ / \ / `-' `-' `-' `-' `-' Andrew Schuetze Apschuet@edgewood-sa.k12.tx.us Math & Science Academy (210) 433-1777 1922 S. Gen. McMullen (210) 433-2141 fax San Antonio, Texas 78226 ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 09:29:32 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Geoffrey White Subject: New chip on the NACHO block Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Greetings! I just joined NACHO. My name is Geoff White and I am the chemistry and physics lab supervisor at Joliet Junior College, in Joliet, Illinois, a little south and west of Chicago. We have approximately 10000 students enrolled in transfer and professional training courses. We are trying to make our labs as safe as possible for our students and faculty & staff. I am not very knowledgeable about chemistry safety, and am looking forward to learning what I can from all of you. Thank you for your time. Geoff Geoffrey White gwhite@jjc.cc.il.us Physical Science Lab Supervisor v:(815)280-2421 Joliet Junior College f:(815)280-6671 ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 07:58:19 -0700 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Nick Spare Subject: Power Plants MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi all, This does not have much to do with laboratory safety, however, I am puzzled and I wonder if anyone has further information. In a news story dated 4/9, a Tampa Bay electric power plant suffered a major explosion which killed two workers. The story states that the explosion was caused by a hydrogen leak and that hydrogen is used as a COOLANT for the generators. This sounds kind of weird to me. Do electricity generators use H2 (liguid?) as a coolant or is this a case of some reporter getting confused? Nick Spare Pilot Chemical Co. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 11:15:07 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Ian Fraser Subject: Re: Power Plants In-Reply-To: <002001be84f4$ec9c3760$7084480c@nick> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" H2 gas is used in generators to reduce friction. H2 tends to migrate through steel and has always been a problem on generator floors. At 10:58 AM 4/12/99 , you wrote: >Hi all, > >This does not have much to do with laboratory safety, however, I am puzzled >and I wonder if anyone has further information. > >In a news story dated 4/9, a Tampa Bay electric power plant suffered a major >explosion which killed two workers. The story states that the explosion was >caused by a hydrogen leak and that hydrogen is used as a COOLANT for the >generators. This sounds kind of weird to me. Do electricity generators use >H2 (liguid?) as a coolant or is this a case of some reporter getting >confused? > >Nick Spare >Pilot Chemical Co. > Thanks in advance Ian Fraser Safety Office University of Waterloo 200 University Ave. W. Waterloo, ON Canada, N2L 3G1 mailto:igfraser@uwaterloo.ca http://www.safetyoffice.uwaterloo.ca ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 11:27:07 +0000 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Karen Glover Organization: Clarke College Subject: Re: Power Plants MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit H2 as a coolant? I could imagine N2. An easy typo for someone not familiar with the two substances. Karen Glover Clarke College Nick Spare wrote: > Hi all, > > This does not have much to do with laboratory safety, however, I am puzzled > and I wonder if anyone has further information. > > In a news story dated 4/9, a Tampa Bay electric power plant suffered a major > explosion which killed two workers. The story states that the explosion was > caused by a hydrogen leak and that hydrogen is used as a COOLANT for the > generators. This sounds kind of weird to me. Do electricity generators use > H2 (liguid?) as a coolant or is this a case of some reporter getting > confused? > > Nick Spare > Pilot Chemical Co. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 11:33:59 +0000 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Karen Glover Organization: Clarke College Subject: Re: Power Plants MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Is this really so? Why use hydrogen? Karen Glover Clarke College Ian Fraser wrote: > H2 gas is used in generators to reduce friction. H2 tends to migrate > through steel and has always been a problem on generator floors. > > At 10:58 AM 4/12/99 , you wrote: > >Hi all, > > > >This does not have much to do with laboratory safety, however, I am puzzled > >and I wonder if anyone has further information. > > > >In a news story dated 4/9, a Tampa Bay electric power plant suffered a major > >explosion which killed two workers. The story states that the explosion was > >caused by a hydrogen leak and that hydrogen is used as a COOLANT for the > >generators. This sounds kind of weird to me. Do electricity generators use > >H2 (liguid?) as a coolant or is this a case of some reporter getting > >confused? > > > >Nick Spare > >Pilot Chemical Co. > > > Thanks in advance > > Ian Fraser > Safety Office > University of Waterloo > 200 University Ave. W. > Waterloo, ON > Canada, N2L 3G1 > mailto:igfraser@uwaterloo.ca > http://www.safetyoffice.uwaterloo.ca ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 12:47:19 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "Robert N. Nelson" Subject: Re: Power Plants In-Reply-To: <3711DA27.AE171ED6@keller.clarke.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Hydrogen gas is used as a coolant in large electrical generators for several reasons. 1. It has a high thermal conductivity and hence removes heat effectively. 2. It has a low viscosity and hence causes little drag on the generator. (both these properties follow from the low mass and small size of the H2 molecule through the kinetic molecular theory of gases) 3. It is non-corrosive and has a reasonably high dielectric constant. As has been mentioned, one BIG problem is that being such a small molecule, it can diffuse through steel or through O-ring gaskets and because of its wide explosive range, can cause a fire or explosion quite easily. Bob Nelson Robert N. Nelson, Ph.D. Associate Professor of Chemistry, Chem. Dept. Georgia Southern Univ. P.O.B. 8064, Statesboro, GA 30460-8064 912-681-5675 (voice) 912-681-0699 (fax) ********* The opinions expressed here are my personal opinions and do not necessarily reflect the views of my employer. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 10:05:54 -0700 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Nick Spare Subject: Re: Power Plants MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Robert - Thanks for the fascinating info. Consider me completely astounded!!! Nick Spare -----Original Message----- From: Robert N. Nelson To: LABSAFETY-L@SIU.EDU Date: Monday, April 12, 1999 9:48 AM Subject: Re: Power Plants >Hydrogen gas is used as a coolant in large electrical generators for >several reasons. >1. It has a high thermal conductivity and hence removes heat effectively. >2. It has a low viscosity and hence causes little drag on the generator. >(both these properties follow from the low mass and small size of the H2 >molecule through the kinetic molecular theory of gases) >3. It is non-corrosive and has a reasonably high dielectric constant. > >As has been mentioned, one BIG problem is that being such a small molecule, >it can diffuse through steel or through O-ring gaskets and because of its >wide explosive range, can cause a fire or explosion quite easily. > >Bob Nelson > >Robert N. Nelson, Ph.D. >Associate Professor of Chemistry, Chem. Dept. Georgia Southern Univ. >P.O.B. 8064, Statesboro, GA 30460-8064 912-681-5675 (voice) 912-681-0699 (fax) >********* > The opinions expressed here are my personal opinions and do not >necessarily reflect the views of my employer. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 13:47:54 +0000 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Karen Glover Organization: Clarke College Subject: Re: Power Plants MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I'll second Nick's comments. Thanks to all for sharing their expertise on this list. Karen Glover Clarke College Nick Spare wrote: > Robert - Thanks for the fascinating info. Consider me completely > astounded!!! > > Nick Spare > > -----Original Message----- > From: Robert N. Nelson > To: LABSAFETY-L@SIU.EDU > Date: Monday, April 12, 1999 9:48 AM > Subject: Re: Power Plants > > >Hydrogen gas is used as a coolant in large electrical generators for > >several reasons. > >1. It has a high thermal conductivity and hence removes heat effectively. > >2. It has a low viscosity and hence causes little drag on the generator. > >(both these properties follow from the low mass and small size of the H2 > >molecule through the kinetic molecular theory of gases) > >3. It is non-corrosive and has a reasonably high dielectric constant. > > > >As has been mentioned, one BIG problem is that being such a small molecule, > >it can diffuse through steel or through O-ring gaskets and because of its > >wide explosive range, can cause a fire or explosion quite easily. > > > >Bob Nelson > > > >Robert N. Nelson, Ph.D. > >Associate Professor of Chemistry, Chem. Dept. Georgia Southern Univ. > >P.O.B. 8064, Statesboro, GA 30460-8064 912-681-5675 (voice) 912-681-0699 > (fax) > >********* > > The opinions expressed here are my personal opinions and do not > >necessarily reflect the views of my employer. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 14:36:54 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Lenore Koliha Subject: carc. deactivation MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Good day.... I am looking for a carcinogen deactivation procedure for "N-nitroso bis, 2-(oxypropyl)amine". Any and all help is greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance! ***************************************************************** * * * Lenore Koliha e-mail: lkoliha@creighton.edu * * Chemical Coordinator ph#: (402)546-6404 * * Dept. EH&S fax: (402)546-6403 * * Creighton U. * * Jahn Bldg., Rm-110 * * 2204 Burt St. * * Omaha, NE 68178 * ***************************************************************** The true measure of a man is not by the life he leads... but by the memory he leaves behind. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 13 Apr 1999 12:06:39 +1000 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: John Williams Subject: MSDS Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii I was wondering if any subscribers would be able to assist me with obtaining a MSDS on "Hexane Diol diacrylate" Thank you John Williams Pinnacle Safety Australia ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 13 Apr 1999 07:49:14 -0400 Reply-To: lmz0@ms1.allencol.edu Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: lucy zotter Organization: allentown college Subject: CHO Certification MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit My employers are reluctant to let me take the certification exam. They want to know what advantage they would have if I were certified. Can anyone give me a good academic answere? Lucy M. Zotter ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 13 Apr 1999 08:06:51 -0400 Reply-To: fullert@bc.edu Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Thomas Fuller Subject: Re: MSDS In-Reply-To: <4A256752.0010FFEA.00@npanote02.npal.com.au> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII John, I found an MSDS for 1,6-Hexanediol Diacrylate from Aldrich Chemical Co. Inc. at website http://siri.org/msds/h/q395/q219.html Tom On Tue, 13 Apr 1999 12:06:39 +1000 John Williams wrote: > I was wondering if any subscribers would be able to assist me with > obtaining a MSDS on > "Hexane Diol diacrylate" > Thank you > John Williams > Pinnacle Safety Australia ---------------------- Thomas Fuller Chemical Hygiene Officer fullert@bc.edu Boston College ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 13 Apr 1999 12:03:07 PST8PDT Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "Craig R. Burnett" Subject: MSDs for 3-azidopropanol? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT My colleagues and I have been looking for over 4 months for an MSDS for the following chemical that we believe was synthesized by one of our chemistry professors who has subsequently retired. The chemical is labelled as, 3-azidopropanol. There are approximately 4 each 20 ml. ampoules labelled as B.P. is 42-43 (I'm assuming boiling point Centigrade) and its labelled as an "explosive" and "fragile". I'm planning to have an explosive ordnance disposal expert treat and dispose of this material. Any information on this compound, or a close relative would be much appreciated. Thanks Craig Craig R. Burnett Chemical Hygiene Officer Environmental Health & Safety California State University, Sacramento 6000 J Street Sacramento, CA 95819-6085 (916) 278-5165, (916) 278-4359 FAX E-mail: cburnett@csus.edu ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 13 Apr 1999 15:07:34 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Dewey Williams Subject: SpillMate absorbent Comments: To: SAFETY@LIST.UVM.EDU, chemed-l@atlantis.uwf.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Is anyone familiar with this product. It is being marketed as a solvent absorbent for chemical spill cleanup. We are thinking of purchasing it for lab spill kits but would like more 'third-party' information. Dewey Williams - Lab Manager mailto:williams@email.uncc.edu UNC-Charlotte Chemistry Dept. http://www.chem.uncc.edu "These are my ideas and no one else will claim them." "If you are not part of the solution, you are part of the precipitate" ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 13 Apr 1999 14:57:47 +0000 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Comments: Authenticated sender is From: Herman curtis Subject: SpillMate MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT I think SpillMate is the brand name of polyethylene beads that soak up hydrocarbons and such. It makes a nice shovelable mass out of a gooey mess. Herman Curtis Department of Physical Science Cameron University 2800 W Gore Blvd Lawton, OK 73505 hermanc@cameron.edu (580)591-8007 ,(580)581-2323 ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 13 Apr 1999 15:09:18 +0000 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Comments: Authenticated sender is From: Herman curtis Subject: MSDs for 3-azidopropanol? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Craig Burnett wrote concerning 3-azidopropanol: ....."explosive" and "fragile"....Any information on this compound, or a close relative would be much appreciated. Your next of kin should be listed on your insurance forms ;-) Herman Curtis Department of Physical Science Cameron University 2800 W Gore Blvd Lawton, OK 73505 hermanc@cameron.edu (580)591-8007 ,(580)581-2323 ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 13 Apr 1999 14:33:07 -0600 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "Carolyn S. Jaussi" Subject: Re: MSDS In-Reply-To: <4A256752.0010FFEA.00@npanote02.npal.com.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Take a look in the Aldrich catalog. Their catalog # 24,681-6 is your product. Their MSDS's are available at the Sigma/Aldrich web site. Good luck! At 12:06 PM 4/13/99 +1000, you wrote: >I was wondering if any subscribers would be able to assist me with >obtaining a MSDS on >"Hexane Diol diacrylate" >Thank you >John Williams >Pinnacle Safety Australia > *************************************************************** Carolyn S. Jaussi Biologist, CHO USDA ARS FRRL Utah State University 700 N 1100 E Logan UT 84322-6300 Phone: (435)-797-3222 FAX: (435)-797-3075 Email: csjaussi@cc.usu.edu *************************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 13 Apr 1999 16:32:09 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Mary Ann Solstad Subject: Re: SpillMate absorbent In-Reply-To: <4.2.0.32.19990413150526.0098cbb0@newmail.uncc.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" The Lab Safety catalogue has enough information that you can read or surmise the contents of any lab spill material. The Pig catalogue has some good choices. You will want different absorbents for aqueous fluids, aggressive acids or bases, or organic solvents. Some will absorb oils, but not water, for instance. Ask for some samples. Pig will send samples, then try them. Mary Ann At 03:07 PM 4/13/99 -0400, you wrote: >Is anyone familiar with this product. It is being marketed as a solvent >absorbent for chemical spill cleanup. We are thinking of purchasing it for >lab spill kits but would like more 'third-party' information. > > >Dewey Williams - Lab Manager >mailto:williams@email.uncc.edu >UNC-Charlotte Chemistry Dept. http://www.chem.uncc.edu >"These are my ideas and no one else will claim them." >"If you are not part of the solution, you are part of the precipitate" > Mary Ann Solstad, CIH 4 A's of Safety SOLSTAD Health & Safety Evaluations Attitude 16 Pequot Rd, Marblehead, MA 01945 Awareness 781-631-4748 tel, 781-631-1832 FAX Automatic Application Authority Past Chair, DivCHAS, ACS msolstad@mediaone.net ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 13 Apr 1999 13:58:36 -0700 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Michael Ahler Subject: MSDs for 3-azidopropanol? In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; name="MSDs" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Craig, I have no MSDS for your 3-azidopropanol, but Bretherick lists some interesting descriptions for a related compound: for azidoacetone ( azido-2-propanone): "A small sample exploded after storage in the dark after 6 months [1]. The freshly prepared material explodes when dropped on to a hotplate and burns brilliantly [2]." ( I wonder if this was a deliberate test. I doubt it. M.A.) If you have been storing this for four months, my guess is the fuse is getting short. Professional explosives disposal sounds like a good idea - the sooner the better. Good Luck Michael Ahler, CHO mahler@calpoly.edu Risk Management Cal Poly San Luis Obispo, California ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 13 Apr 1999 17:49:43 -0700 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: James Kapin Subject: Job Announcements Comments: cc: sue@riso.fullerton.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" The California Campus Environmental Health and Safety Association (CCEHSA) is pleased to announce several recent job announcements at its web site - go to the jobs link at the bottom of the page. CCEHSA is a group of dedicated professionals from schools, colleges and universities small and large throughout California promoting increased effectiveness of campus safety and health programs. See the web site for more information. Jim Kapin UCSD Chemical Safety Officer Mail Code 0920 9500 Gilman Drive, La Jolla CA 92093 (619)534-2823 fax (619)534-7982 mailto:jkapin@ucsd.edu ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 10:36:33 EDT Reply-To: NRCC6@aol.com Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Gilbert Smith Subject: Re: CHO Certification Comments: To: lmz0@ms1.allencol.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 4/13/99 7:51:00 AM Eastern Daylight Time, lmz0@ms1.allencol.edu writes: > My employers are reluctant to let me take the certification exam. They > want to know what advantage they would have if I were certified. Can > anyone give me a good academic answere? > Lucy M. Zotter > In the event the college's safety program is reviewed by an agency interested in protecting the public interest in safety, there should be some comfort in showing its Chemical Hygiene Officer meets the standards endorsed by eight major chemical organizations. As a parallel, individual certification can be compared to the college's accreditation by a nationally recognized regional accrediting agency. Similarly, one could ask why should the college be accredited? FYI: BECOMING A CERTIFIED CHEMICAL HYGIENE OFFICER While federal regulations require the appointment of a Chemical Hygiene Officer, the regulations do not specify the qualifications needed by a Chemical Hygiene Officer. Employers appointing CHOs may use many and various criterions as qualifications. A Task Force on Safety Certification met in Washington, D.C. in 1994 and proposed the creation of a certification program for persons with responsibilities of Chemical Hygiene Officers as outlined in the Occupational Safety and Health Administration Laboratory Standard. In the interest of public safety the Task Force wanted basic, minimal standards set to identify CHOs. In 1996 a national panel of chemists developed guidelines for a certification program for CHOs based on education, experience, and examination. NRCC certification of Chemical Hygiene Officers began in 1997. Its certification program is sponsored by eight major chemical organizations. NRCC certified CHOs meet the standards endorsed by major chemical organizations instead of the standards of an individual person or employer. In 1997 the Center for Laboratories of the Health Care Financing Administration recognized certification by NRCC as a means of qualifying individuals with doctoral degrees as clinical consultants and directors of high-complexity testing under the Clinical Laboratory Improvement Amendments. Various states have passed legislation recognizing NRCC certification as a method of obtaining licensure by certain laboratory personnel. Certified chemists may use their listing in the NRCC annual directory as one credential supporting their expert witness status. Individuals seek certification to enhance their professionalism in their career fields and among their peers. Suggested reference: "Becoming a CHO," by Warren K. Kingsley, Chemical Health & Safety, May/June 1997, copyright 1997 American Chemical Society Gilbert Smith ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 11:26:39 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Nick Pinizzotto Subject: Nitrosamine MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sorry folks, Someone just submitted a question about nitrosamine destruction and I deleted it. Just now reviewing a protocol for a researcher using methylbenzylnitrosamine and she has cited a protocol (NCI) for 100% destruction. If this is the nitrosamine compound, please e-mail me and I'll get you the info. Nick Pinizzotto Environmental Health Officer Dept. Environmental Health & Safety Thomas Jefferson University nick.pinizzotto@mail.tju.edu 215-503-5853 ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 11:51:57 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Bob Burns Subject: MSDS source MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit check it out: http://www.msdssearch.com/ "SEMPER ADVENTURUS!!!" Robert L. Burns R&D Group Leader Specialty Chemicals Division RUETGERS Organics Corporation 201 Struble Road State College, PA 16801 phone 814-231-9214 fax 815 333 4805 email rburns@bigfoot.com ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 11:00:47 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "Dr. Linda A. Swihart" Subject: Re: MSDS source In-Reply-To: <004201be868e$ba9ecd40$0100007f@bburns> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 11:51 AM 4/14/99 -0400, Robert L. Burns wrote: >check it out: > >http://www.msdssearch.com/ This and quite a number of other MSDS sites are available from the LSW web site. Go to http://www.labsafety.org/ and choose Services. The link to Chem Info/MSDSs is in the resulting lower frame Linda PS let me know if you ever find any links that have expired or otherwise don't work. Thanks. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 13:11:27 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Lily Lodhi Subject: Position available Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII We are in the process of reevaluating our compensation for this position respect to the job market. Position: Health Physicist/Industrial Hygienist Institution: Temple University Environmental Health and Radiation Safety Department Location: Philadelphia, PA QUALIFICATIONS: Bachelor's degree and two years environmental health and safety experience required. Master's degree preferred. Strong demonstrated mathematical and computer skills required. The ability to lift heavy boxes up to twenty five pounds required. The ability to travel to off-site locations that may not be accessible via public transportation required. DUTIES: Under the direction of the Director, responsible for the day to day implementation of the University policies and procedures concerning chemical, biological and radiation safety. Develop and implement programs to ensure and maintain compliance with city, state and federal laws, regulations and recommendations associated with the use of hazardous chemicals and radioactive materials. Other duties as assigned How to apply: Fax your resume along with salary requirement to (215) 707-1600. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 16:23:40 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Nick Pinizzotto Subject: Book of expiration dates MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I just recieved a request from a researcher who wanted a book on chemical expiration dates. specifically, how long a particular chemical is good for once opened. I don't recall ever seeing (or hearing about for that matter) one in the past but thought I'd post the question to the NACHOs. Any reply is appreciated! Even if it agrees with my memory. Nick Pinizzotto Environmental Health Officer Dept. Environmental Health & Safety Thomas Jefferson University nick.pinizzotto@mail.tju.edu 215-503-5853 ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 16:30:55 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Bob Burns Subject: Re: Book of expiration dates MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Never heard of such a thing. Depends on the material, container, conditions, etc. etc. ----- Original Message ----- From: Nick Pinizzotto To: Sent: Wednesday, April 14, 1999 16:23 Subject: Book of expiration dates > I just recieved a request from a researcher who wanted a book on chemical > expiration dates. specifically, how long a particular chemical is good for > once opened. > > I don't recall ever seeing (or hearing about for that matter) one in the past > but thought I'd post the question to the NACHOs. > > > Any reply is appreciated! Even if it agrees with my memory. > > Nick Pinizzotto > Environmental Health Officer > Dept. Environmental Health & Safety > Thomas Jefferson University > nick.pinizzotto@mail.tju.edu > 215-503-5853 > > ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 08:25:42 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Jim Jenkins Subject: Re: Book of expiration dates Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Some chemical companies provide "typical shelf life" times in their catalogs. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 11:55:57 -0700 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Russ Phifer Subject: Re: Book of expiration dates MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In regards to the expiration date issue, there are no standards for this that can be trusted. I am in the final stages of an article on expiration dates for Chemical Health & Safety magazine, and my research failed to turn up any comprehensive references at all. There are numerous references to expiration dates on peroxide-formers, in particular, and a few regulatory-mandated limits on very specific test reagents and procedures from FDA, OSHA, and several laboratory accrediting organizations, but no definitive lists. Keep in mind, there are numerous factors that contribute to how long a chemical maintains it's integrity. These might include humidity, light, and temperature in addition to the specific properties of the subject chemical..... Russ Phifer On Wed, 14 Apr 1999 16:23:40 -0400 Nick Pinizzotto writes: >I just recieved a request from a researcher who wanted a book on >chemical >expiration dates. specifically, how long a particular chemical is good >for >once opened. > >I don't recall ever seeing (or hearing about for that matter) one in >the past >but thought I'd post the question to the NACHOs. > > >Any reply is appreciated! Even if it agrees with my memory. > >Nick Pinizzotto >Environmental Health Officer >Dept. Environmental Health & Safety >Thomas Jefferson University >nick.pinizzotto@mail.tju.edu >215-503-5853 > ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 09:20:13 -0700 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Michael Ahler Subject: Bleach Substitutes Comments: To: Nichols_Gary_S/cpslo_employee1@degas.artisan.calpoly.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; name="Bleach" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Gary, Thanks for the opportunity to provide training to your folks recently. As you ( and a number of them) have requested, I offer here a few suggestions for bleach substitutes which I have solicited from others. I have not tried any of these myself. I would like to suggest you try all of these and let me know how each of them works out: Borax - use the powder on a wet brush or sponge to scrub the moldy surface(s). I would imagine a water rinse/washdown is advisable to remove the substantial residue that will obviously result from this. Baking Soda ( sodium bicarbonate powder) - use in a similar fashion as the borax. I'm told this works well on the gasket on a refrigerator door. X-14 (this is a commercial product) - This is actually a solution of bleach and sodium carbonate. The sodium carbonate ingredient makes the mixture less vulnerable to acid contact ( It would take more acid to achieve the deleterious effects of the notorius acid/bleach combination.). It also has the added feature of being supplied ( as far as I have seen) in a pump spray bottle and in ready-to-use concentration. This would discourage if not prevent the making of "special mixtures" and the "full strength bleach" problem you described to me earlier. Shaklee Basic G - This is a new one for me. I have requested more information on this material from the person that suggested it to me. This product is an EPA registered disinfectant and apparently an environmentally friendly substitute for bleach. I am aware of a number of people interested in this bleach substitute information - for the same reason you are. I am also sending this message to the list you see in the header - to share what information we have so far. Let me know what you come up with after you have given these things a whirl. Also, how soon can you get me a copy of your MSDS books. I would like to get going with the Green Sheets for them. Thanks. Mike Ahler ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 10:51:42 -0600 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "Greene, Ben" Subject: Re: Book of expiration dates MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain > On Wed, 14 Apr 1999 16:23:40 -0400 Nick Pinizzotto > writes: > >I just recieved a request from a researcher who wanted a book on > >chemical > You may also find specific expiration dates on chemical standards supplied by the infinite number of suppliers who tout NIST traceability. NIST is also a good source for expiration dates, they have an expiration on about everything they sell. In industries who go the ISO 9000 route, people may actually choose to purchase standards that have an expiration date versus those that don't, so they don't have to think about what they are doing or the chemistry going on in the solution; and just discard it by the expiration date and buy new stuff. Works great for those who don't want to think, have a lot of money, and generate a lot of waste. In some respects, expiration dates are probably used as a marketing ploy for these people. I had a batch of electronic grade concentrated sulfuric acid with an expiration date. The date meant that the manufacturer would not "guarantee" the assay after that date even if the bottles had never been opened. I also had a batch of methylene chloride (unopened, seals intact) which I did not need, but the manufacturer would not accept back as product because the "expiration" date (which was not printed on the label) had been exceeded. I would consult the quality control divisions of some of the major manufacturer's for their policies on expiration dates. Ben ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 11:29:43 -0600 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "Carolyn S. Jaussi" Subject: Re: Bleach Substitutes In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Hi, I have used a product called Physan 20, traditionally used in greenhouse and growth chamber operations, and have found it an excellent controller of bacteria/fungi/algae etc on walking surfaces. It is a detergent containing benzalkonium chloride. We find it excellent on shower floors, etc. Carolyn At 09:20 AM 4/15/99 -0700, you wrote: >Gary, >Thanks for the opportunity to provide training to your folks recently. >As you ( and a number of them) have requested, I offer here a few >suggestions for bleach substitutes which I have solicited from others. >I have not tried any of these myself. I would like to suggest you try >all of these and let me know how each of them works out: > >Borax - use the powder on a wet brush or sponge to scrub the moldy >surface(s). I would imagine a water rinse/washdown is advisable to >remove the substantial residue that will obviously result from this. > >Baking Soda ( sodium bicarbonate powder) - use in a similar fashion as >the borax. I'm told this works well on the gasket on a refrigerator >door. > >X-14 (this is a commercial product) - This is actually a solution of >bleach and sodium carbonate. The sodium carbonate ingredient makes the >mixture less vulnerable to acid contact ( It would take more acid to >achieve the deleterious effects of the notorius acid/bleach >combination.). It also has the added feature of being supplied ( as >far as I have seen) in a pump spray bottle and in ready-to-use >concentration. This would discourage if not prevent the making of >"special mixtures" and the "full strength bleach" problem you described >to me earlier. > >Shaklee Basic G - This is a new one for me. I have requested more >information on this material from the person that suggested it to me. >This product is an EPA registered disinfectant and apparently an >environmentally friendly substitute for bleach. > >I am aware of a number of people interested in this bleach substitute >information - for the same reason you are. I am also sending this >message to the list you see in the header - to share what information we >have so far. Let me know what you come up with after you have given >these things a whirl. > >Also, how soon can you get me a copy of your MSDS books. I would like >to get going with the Green Sheets for them. > >Thanks. >Mike Ahler > *************************************************************** Carolyn S. Jaussi Biologist, CHO USDA ARS FRRL Utah State University 700 N 1100 E Logan UT 84322-6300 Phone: (435)-797-3222 FAX: (435)-797-3075 Email: csjaussi@cc.usu.edu *************************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 14:41:39 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Don Abramowitz Subject: Re: Bleach Substitutes Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit We have also eliminated household bleach from our housekeeping departments, and, like Carolyn, I can endorse the quaternary ammonium compound-containing cleaners for routine bathroom/shower cleaning. Regular use prevents mold, but I doubt it would remove old mold stains. X-14 (or Tilex® - essentially the same thing) is probably the right thing for the old growth/stains. Every manufacturer of comprehensive lines of commercial cleaning products seems to offer at least one quaternary ammonium disinfectant cleaner. Just for example, "Dimension II® disinfectant non-alkaline cleaner" from Butcher Co., Marlborough, MA, 508-481-5700 is one we use. Didecyldimethyl ammonium chloride and alkyl dimethyl benzyl ammonium chloride are two more examples of these compounds. They are EPA registered products, listed as effective fungicidal, virucidal, and bactericidal agents (for various, but not all categories of bacteria). Not quite our first choice for bloodborne pathogen disinfection, though they are listed as effective against HIV-1, as they lack a listing as anti-tuberculoidal agents. For disinfection in body fluid clean-up scenarios, our first choice bleach substitute is/are? phenolic disinfectants, which usually also contain a big slug of ethanol. Don ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Donald Abramowitz, CIH Occupational and Environmental Safety Officer Bryn Mawr College | Swarthmore College 101 N. Merion Avenue | 500 College Avenue Bryn Mawr, PA 19010 | Swarthmore PA 19081 ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 14:51:14 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Naomi Kelly Subject: Re: Bleach Substitutes In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-14, as well as many of the other cleaners mentioned, is extremely irritating to the respiratory system--you will still need good ventilation. At 02:41 PM 4/15/99 -0400, you wrote: >We have also eliminated household bleach from our housekeeping departments, >and, like Carolyn, I can endorse the quaternary ammonium >compound-containing cleaners for routine bathroom/shower cleaning. Regular >use prevents mold, but I doubt it would remove old mold stains. X-14 (or >Tilex® - essentially the same thing) is probably the right thing for the >old growth/stains. > >Every manufacturer of comprehensive lines of commercial cleaning products >seems to offer at least one quaternary ammonium disinfectant cleaner. Just >for example, "Dimension II® disinfectant non-alkaline cleaner" from Butcher >Co., Marlborough, MA, 508-481-5700 is one we use. Didecyldimethyl ammonium >chloride and alkyl dimethyl benzyl ammonium chloride are two more examples >of these compounds. > >They are EPA registered products, listed as effective fungicidal, >virucidal, and bactericidal agents (for various, but not all categories of >bacteria). Not quite our first choice for bloodborne pathogen >disinfection, though they are listed as effective against HIV-1, as they >lack a listing as anti-tuberculoidal agents. For disinfection in body >fluid clean-up scenarios, our first choice bleach substitute is/are? >phenolic disinfectants, which usually also contain a big slug of ethanol. > > Don > > > >~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Donald Abramowitz, CIH > Occupational and Environmental Safety Officer > > Bryn Mawr College | Swarthmore College > 101 N. Merion Avenue | 500 College Avenue > Bryn Mawr, PA 19010 | Swarthmore PA 19081 ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 07:07:52 +1200 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Tony Haggerty Subject: Re: Bleach Substitutes MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit How about Sodium Perborate? It is sold here as an alternative to Chlorine based bleaches for household use and for those rare few that still use diapers, for whitening them. My wife uses it all the time!! Tony ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 13:17:35 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Fran Martin Subject: 225,000+ MSDS CD-ROM Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Lab professionals responsible for developing Hazard Communications Plans, government-mandated MSDS libraries, and meeting hazardous materials reporting requirements may find this a useful reference: A database of over 225,000 Material Safety Data Sheets (MSDS) for trade name and generic chemicals has been updated on a three-CD-ROM set. The set features the Environmental Reporting Assist File (ERAF) and Registry of Lists (ROL) databases. See http://www.env-sol.com/solutions/MSDS.HTML for details. Fran Martin FM Research & Consulting ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 06:57:05 -0700 Reply-To: Marc Neuffer Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Marc Neuffer Organization: SafetyInfo.Com Subject: New Additions MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Friends... Just a short note to let you know of the new additions this week to our free safety information site: [Weekly Safety Brief] - print out & pass along to supervisors [Weekly Safety Poster] - print & post on your employee bulletin boards [Power Point Presentation] - tutorial on the NAERG [Safety Atricles] - Medical aspects of OSHAs new Resp. Standard [Editorial] - just our way of performing a little safety CPR for the mind Regards & Best Wishes Marc Neuffer www.safetyinfo.com ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 09:46:33 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Peter Ashbrook Subject: Last call for poster presentations in New Orleans Comments: To: SAFETY@LIST.UVM.EDU Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" This is your last chance as time is running out. At the summer American Chemical Society national meeting in New Orleans this August, the Division of Chemical Technicians is organizing a symposium entitled, "Safety Issues in Our Laboratories." The symposium will be cosponsored by the Division of Chemical Health and Safety, and the Young Chemists Committee. As part of this symposium, I am orgnaizing a poster symposium on compliance with the OSHA Laboratory Standard. This is a chance to share various aspects of your program and related issues with others. IF YOU ARE WILLING TO MAKE A POSTER PRESENTATION, please contact me by email. Abstracts are due by April 26, which is next Monday. Fortunately, abstracts can be submitted through the Web as follows: Go to the following ACS Web Page: http://www.acs.org/meetings/abstract/newway.htm Select the "New Way" as opposed to the "Old Way" and you can do everything on line. The key points are to: 1) select the Division of Chemical Health and Safety (CHAS) as the division 2) select "General Papers" 3) indicate poster session If you have any interest in participating or any questions about this, please email me. Peter C. Ashbrook, CHMM, Assistant Director Chemical Safety Section Division of Environmental Health and Safety University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign 217/244-9278 ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 16:44:31 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Gian Hofer Subject: Corroding fume-hood/vents MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit If anyone shares any experience with a similar problem to the following, your insight or input would be greatly appreciated. An analytical lab located is on 1st floor of a multi-story office building. Significant corrosion has been reported in the vent for the fume-hood. The vent is aluminum and there are signs oxidation. The fume hood is also corroding quickly due to insufficient ventilation. Many corrosives are used in the fume-hood. My only easy question is: Are fume-hood vents normally aluminum?? Your responses are appreciated, Gian (John) Hofer Regulatory Affairs Specialist Raisio Chemicals ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 16:35:47 -0500 Reply-To: "swiki@bihs.net" Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Swiki Anderson Subject: Re: Corroding fume-hood/vents MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Fume hoods and fume hood duct work that serve them can be made of Al, steel, PVC, Ss steel, or the other materials for that matter. In some cases Al is a satisfactory material. Most often however the typical work being done in a hood dictates the use of materials other than Al. There is a common but often mistaken belief that 304 or 316 stainless steel is the optimum material of choice for fume hood applications. This however is not true with some chemicals. Nitric acid plays havoc with stainless steel. The best "generic" material we have dealt with for ducting material is PVC coated galvanized steel. It too, however, has some limitations and those limitations depend on the chemical used in a hood. I suggest you contact a engineer that has some knowledge concerning chemicals you are using and ducting material that serve a hood; the American Society for Metals publishes some excellent guides for metal versus chemical selections. Swiki A. Anderson, Ph.D.,P.E President Swiki Anderson and Associates, Inc. Consulting Mechanical, Electrical and Instrumentation Engineers Bryan, Texas . -----Original Message----- From: Gian Hofer [SMTP:raisio@NAS.NET] Sent: Tuesday, April 20, 1999 4:45 PM To: LABSAFETY-L@SIU.EDU Subject: Corroding fume-hood/vents If anyone shares any experience with a similar problem to the following, your insight or input would be greatly appreciated. An analytical lab located is on 1st floor of a multi-story office building. Significant corrosion has been reported in the vent for the fume-hood. The vent is aluminum and there are signs oxidation. The fume hood is also corroding quickly due to insufficient ventilation. Many corrosives are used in the fume-hood. My only easy question is: Are fume-hood vents normally aluminum?? Your responses are appreciated, Gian (John) Hofer Regulatory Affairs Specialist Raisio Chemicals ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 15:27:44 -0700 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Debbie Decker Subject: bench height Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" A question from our Structural folks: "Do any of you know if there is a maximum height for a reagent shelf over an existing island bench?" My first impression would be whatever height the user needs but I'm not up on the latest in lab design requirements. Any ideas? Thanks, gang. Deb. Debbie Decker EH&S UCDavis (530)754-7964 dmdecker@ucdavis.edu ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 16:39:45 -0700 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Gordon Miller Subject: Re: Corroding fume-hood/vents In-Reply-To: <371CF53F.BB355EE4@nas.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Aluminum is prone to corrosion damage. When you consider the range of materials that can be used in hoods, just about anything you name as hood material could be attacked. Hoods and Navy aircraft are painted to control corrosion. But corrosive materials will work through paint. Airplane paint is stripped and the bare metal is passivated, primed, then topcoated. I haven't seen that done with hoods. The Harrington Plastics catalog has good compatibility guidance for various materials. Some hood vendors will also have compatibility data as well. I've seen stainless steel, painted metal, and "plastic" material do well. But don't try stainless around acids. It stains nicely! Gordon Miller, CIH CHO Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory miller22@llnl.gov -------------------------------- >If anyone shares any experience with a similar problem to the following, >your insight or input would be greatly appreciated. > >An analytical lab located is on 1st floor of a multi-story office >building. Significant corrosion has been reported in the vent for the >fume-hood. The vent is aluminum and there are signs oxidation. The >fume hood is also corroding quickly due to insufficient ventilation. >Many corrosives are used in the fume-hood. > >My only easy question is: Are fume-hood vents normally aluminum?? > >Your responses are appreciated, > >Gian (John) Hofer >Regulatory Affairs Specialist >Raisio Chemicals ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 09:26:39 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "Chang, Jim C" Subject: Re: Corroding fume-hood/vents MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit John A lot of what you pick should be dependant upon what chemicals and what concentrations that your people handle. In general: - Aluminum is pretty reactive and is not a good material for hood or ducts. - In the event of a fire(e.g., if you use a lot of solvent in your hoods), aluminum has a low meltpoint and will fail before a steel duct/hood system. This can release fire into your lab and interstitial spaces. - If you use a lot of perchloric acid, there are specific requirements for this material. - Stainless steel is a good general solution to the issue, however, it is expensive and still subject to attack by some materials. - Flame retardant FRP (fiberglass reinforced plastic) is a good material for heavy acid use, but is subject to some solvent attacks. - Design your system with sufficient duct velocity to ensure good transport (minimizing condensation) and no dead legs. As a sidebar, you might want to investigate the chemistry - is it possible to scrub some of the corrosive agents from the process before dumping them into he hood space? Jim C. -----Original Message----- From: Gian Hofer [SMTP:raisio@NAS.NET] Sent: Tuesday, April 20, 1999 5:45 PM To: LABSAFETY-L@SIU.EDU Subject: Corroding fume-hood/vents If anyone shares any experience with a similar problem to the following, your insight or input would be greatly appreciated. An analytical lab located is on 1st floor of a multi-story office building. Significant corrosion has been reported in the vent for the fume-hood. The vent is aluminum and there are signs oxidation. The fume hood is also corroding quickly due to insufficient ventilation. Many corrosives are used in the fume-hood. My only easy question is: Are fume-hood vents normally aluminum?? Your responses are appreciated, Gian (John) Hofer Regulatory Affairs Specialist Raisio Chemicals ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 09:27:43 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Mark Yanchisin Subject: Re: Corroding fume-hood/vents MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Greeting s all!! As much as it is embarrassing to admit it- we have had a number of hood duct runs corrode and need replacing here. All due to a combination of poor design and the staff not using them in a manner that would minimize the corrosion problem. I will give only 2 examples. First case I dealt with was installed 18 months before the duct corroded through in a line along the bottom of the duct. It was stainless steel, 12 inches in diameter. Lab was digesting (boiling) plant and soil material in either sulfuric or nitric acids. Design problem with this was that there was about 35 feet of horizontal run until it got to the vertical chase. Duct was sloped, barely an 1/8th inch per foot due to minimum overhead space. Another problem was that the building was on the National Register of Historic Buildings and we could not alter the exterior too much. Stack heads for the hoods were shortened to not go above the roof peak (so they could not be seen from the other, more prominent side of the building), and reduced to 4" in diameter. Lab added to the corrosion potential by turning off the hood fan as soon as they pulled their samples off the heating block. Hood was controlled by the lab, as it was a single hood connected to it's own duct and fan motor. Lab staff did not let fan run to continue the exhaust of acid vapors and hot air. They thought that by turning the hood off it would save energy by not exhausting AC'd air, which in that building is at a premium! Hood was also used to pulverize plant and soils before they were digested. Lots of dust went up the hood. Our diagnosis was that hot gasses would condense along the inside of the duct, as it ran through AC'd areas. Turning off the fan maximized condensation and did not continue the airflow to evaporated it. The minimal slope let acidic condensate puddling along the bottom of the duct. Any extraneous soil pulled into the hood during processing stuck to previously deposited condensate and created an acidic mud! New stainless duct was installed with a slightly better slope to allow any drainage back to hood. Lab now keeps fan running for 2 hours after they shut down the digester or pulverizing to remove vapors and particles. We have no problems in the 3 years + since it was reinstalled. Knock on wood- this is 2xs its lifespan before!! Case number 2 was also a horizontal run, actually many horizontal runs, as the duct work was installed a few years after the building was built. It ran 30 feet or so, over, under, around, through, etc a variety of existing pipes, conduits and duct. It was 4"x10" galvanized metal. The lowest bottom flat spots corroded first and worst, but all angles, joints and flat spots were corroded. Lab was also using lots of nitric for digestions. They left the hood running all the time as it is the only exhaust for the lab. Duct lasted 20+ years. Hood is in great shape. Our solution is not something I was proud of, but... We replaced the rectangular duct with the same. It was run flat, in one long piece under the existing building piping- it was not fit around, over and under stuff. We had to lower the ceiling in the hallway to accommodate it. Management's decision was to install the advised round stainless duct would be too much money, work and cause too much space to be used. Decision was made that if the new flat galvanized duct needed to be replaced again, even after five or ten years, it was cheaper than stainless. We argued and lost. Our lessons learned (EH&S knew all this before, but it reinforced the concepts to the designers and Physical Plant): Keep the horizontal duct runs to a an absolute minimum, slope the duct enough to run any condensate back to the hood (where it is relatively easy to clean), keep the fans running until a after everything involved in a process has cooled and has exhausted all the vapors, don't retrofit a hood in an older building were the building restrictions do not allow you to install it correctly, and lastly money sometimes wins over doing things the "correct way". Sorry this is so long, but hopefully it helps someone. Anyone having any extra rain they don't want, send it our way. We can use it!! Mark Yanchisin Coordinator for Clinical and Lab Safety Programs University of Florida Env. Health and Safety PO Box 112190 Gainesville, FL 32611-2190 352-846-2550 (T) 352-392-7386 (F) Mark@ehs.ufl.edu Don't say that little things don't bother you, or you will end up sleeping in a room with a mosquito. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 10:09:14 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Bob Burns Subject: explosions MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Another chemical plant explosion in the Allentown area today. Coincidentally, the March 3 issue of Chemical Week just hit my desk- nice little article and photo on the last one. Still no cause given, except that PA people said it likely came from improper mixing of hydroxylamine and KOH. Company disagrees. Does that sound likely to anyone? Bob "SEMPER ADVENTURUS!!!" Robert L. Burns R&D Group Leader Specialty Chemicals Division RUETGERS Organics Corporation 201 Struble Road State College, PA 16801 phone 814-231-9214 fax 815 333 4805 email rburns@bigfoot.com ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 10:40:59 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "Thomas J. Shelley" Subject: Re: Corroding fume-hood/vents In-Reply-To: <01BE8B4B.D8C8D100.swiki@bihs.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" On 4/21 Swiki Anderson wrote: >Fume hoods and fume hood duct work that serve them can be made of Al, >steel, PVC, Ss steel, or the other materials for that matter. ...much >deleted.... >ducting material that serve a hood; the American Society for Metals >publishes some excellent guides for metal versus chemical selections. Swiki--This is very good information and concisely stated. I have been dealing with many of the same engineering and chemical use issues over the past few years and I agree with your conclusions. I have some great photos of high grade stainless steel ductwork only 2 years old that was turned into swiss cheese by hot sulfuic acid. How can we reach the American Society for Metals. Do you have a web site address or phone number? Thanks. Tom ********************************************************* Tom Shelley, Chemical Hygiene Officer, Cornell University Department of Environmental Health and Safety, 125 Humphreys Service Building, Ithaca, NY 14853. (607) 255-4288 tjs1@cornell.edu ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 10:55:59 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Gian Hofer Subject: Re: Corroding fume-hood/vents MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello everyone. Firstly, thanks to all of you who responded. Greatly appreciated. Second, I'll provide a summary, in the hopes it will save someone the nightmare one particular lab is facing. A company decides to combine an office and lab in new office building. The fume-hood specs are given to the developer. The lab is situated on the first floor of 6. When it is time to move in, nobody is aware of the vent system. It happens to be hooked up with the existing vent system (not dedicated). Imagine the smell of bacon wafting into a fumehod from a kitchen on the other side of a building! The developer moves the local fan (at the hood) to the roof, to reduce lost heat/AC. Aluminum vents corrode, 5 floors (other companies) complain of odours, aluminum oxide builds up, and of course, there is insufficient ventilation for safe operation under the hood and the health of the building is questioned. Lab operations are suspended. 2 of 10 years into lease in a cu$tomized lab/office, and the lab cannot be used. Lesson: When designing a lab, hire a qualified engineer(s) and don't overlook anything. This person(s) must ensure that the system is properly installed. Hope this will help somebody in the future. John Mark Yanchisin wrote: > Greeting s all!! > > As much as it is embarrassing to admit it- we have had a number of hood duct > runs corrode and need replacing here. All due to a combination of poor > design and the staff not using them in a manner that would minimize the > corrosion problem. I will give only 2 examples. > > First case I dealt with was installed 18 months before the duct corroded > through in a line along the bottom of the duct. It was stainless steel, 12 > inches in diameter. Lab was digesting (boiling) plant and soil material in > either sulfuric or nitric acids. Design problem with this was that there was > about 35 feet of horizontal run until it got to the vertical chase. Duct > was sloped, barely an 1/8th inch per foot due to minimum overhead space. > > Another problem was that the building was on the National Register of > Historic Buildings and we could not alter the exterior too much. Stack > heads for the hoods were shortened to not go above the roof peak (so they > could not be seen from the other, more prominent side of the building), and > reduced to 4" in diameter. > > Lab added to the corrosion potential by turning off the hood fan as soon as > they pulled their samples off the heating block. Hood was controlled by the > lab, as it was a single hood connected to it's own duct and fan motor. Lab > staff did not let fan run to continue the exhaust of acid vapors and hot > air. They thought that by turning the hood off it would save energy by not > exhausting AC'd air, which in that building is at a premium! Hood was also > used to pulverize plant and soils before they were digested. Lots of dust > went up the hood. > > Our diagnosis was that hot gasses would condense along the inside of the > duct, as it ran through AC'd areas. Turning off the fan maximized > condensation and did not continue the airflow to evaporated it. The minimal > slope let acidic condensate puddling along the bottom of the duct. Any > extraneous soil pulled into the hood during processing stuck to previously > deposited condensate and created an acidic mud! > > New stainless duct was installed with a slightly better slope to allow any > drainage back to hood. Lab now keeps fan running for 2 hours after they > shut down the digester or pulverizing to remove vapors and particles. We > have no problems in the 3 years + since it was reinstalled. Knock on wood- > this is 2xs its lifespan before!! > > Case number 2 was also a horizontal run, actually many horizontal runs, as > the duct work was installed a few years after the building was built. It > ran 30 feet or so, over, under, around, through, etc a variety of existing > pipes, conduits and duct. It was 4"x10" galvanized metal. The lowest > bottom flat spots corroded first and worst, but all angles, joints and flat > spots were corroded. Lab was also using lots of nitric for digestions. > They left the hood running all the time as it is the only exhaust for the > lab. Duct lasted 20+ years. Hood is in great shape. > > Our solution is not something I was proud of, but... We replaced the > rectangular duct with the same. It was run flat, in one long piece under > the existing building piping- it was not fit around, over and under stuff. > We had to lower the ceiling in the hallway to accommodate it. Management's > decision was to install the advised round stainless duct would be too much > money, work and cause too much space to be used. Decision was made that if > the new flat galvanized duct needed to be replaced again, even after five or > ten years, it was cheaper than stainless. We argued and lost. > > Our lessons learned (EH&S knew all this before, but it reinforced the > concepts to the designers and Physical Plant): Keep the horizontal duct runs > to a an absolute minimum, slope the duct enough to run any condensate back > to the hood (where it is relatively easy to clean), keep the fans running > until a after everything involved in a process has cooled and has exhausted > all the vapors, don't retrofit a hood in an older building were the building > restrictions do not allow you to install it correctly, and lastly money > sometimes wins over doing things the "correct way". > > Sorry this is so long, but hopefully it helps someone. Anyone having any > extra rain they don't want, send it our way. We can use it!! > > Mark Yanchisin > Coordinator for Clinical and Lab Safety > Programs > University of Florida Env. Health and Safety > PO Box 112190 > Gainesville, FL 32611-2190 > 352-846-2550 (T) > 352-392-7386 (F) > Mark@ehs.ufl.edu > > Don't say that little things don't bother you, or you will end up sleeping > in a room with a mosquito. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 14:29:36 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "Thomas J. Shelley" Subject: cyanogen test paper Comments: To: SAFETY@LIST.UVM.EDU Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Dear Colleagues--We recently received a request for a cyanogen test paper: >A research group found a reference for leak checking cyanogen that they're >interested in. The procedure uses moist methyl orange-mercuric chloride >test papers. Could you either find the preparation instructions for making >the test papers? We have reviewed many sources of information and have not found a method for making this material. Any ideas or references to the literature of chemistry would be greatly appreciated. Thanks. Tom Shelley ********************************************************* Tom Shelley, Chemical Hygiene Officer, Cornell University Department of Environmental Health and Safety, 125 Humphreys Service Building, Ithaca, NY 14853. (607) 255-4288 tjs1@cornell.edu ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 14:56:22 -0500 Reply-To: "swiki@bihs.net" Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Swiki Anderson Subject: Re: Corroding fume-hood/vents or another laboratory ventilation problem? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit This dialog has been interesting. Sadly however it reinforces what was published in the Federal Register, Wednesday, January 31, 1999, Vol. 55, No. 21, pages 3300, 3303, and 3304. This was the document that promulgated "Occupational Exposures to Hazardous Chemicals in Laboratories". In particular, I quote from page 3304 the following; "The preamble to the proposed standard also included case reports as evidenced of hazardous chemicals exposures in the laboratories (51 FR 26666). In particular, it cited the results of a 1979 survey pertaining to xylene exposures among members of the California Association of Cytotechnologists. The problem noted among the 70 respondents to the survey included inadequate ventilation (59%); lack of an exhaust system (22.6%); and lack of inspection of the exhaust system (43%)." The locations change, the chemical changes and the beat goes on and we encounter the same ventilation problems over and over and over and some how never learn from our mista kes. We can do better for those of you who want to do better. Doing better starts with a properly engineered containment based ventilation system that works and is proven to work and is then maintained. If we don't do this, well then some else has to pay the price. What price, well go to http://www.saai-svc.com/engineer/html/tech-notes.htm and click on the item starting with "WEB LINKS ..." and read on. We can do better if we really want to... -----Original Message----- From: Gian Hofer [SMTP:raisio@NAS.NET] Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 1999 10:56 AM To: LABSAFETY-L@SIU.EDU Subject: Re: Corroding fume-hood/vents Hello everyone. Firstly, thanks to all of you who responded. Greatly appreciated. Second, I'll provide a summary, in the hopes it will save someone the nightmare one particular lab is facing. A company decides to combine an office and lab in new office building. The fume-hood specs are given to the developer. The lab is situated on the first floor of 6. When it is time to move in, nobody is aware of the vent system. It happens to be hooked up with the existing vent system (not dedicated). Imagine the smell of bacon wafting into a fumehod from a kitchen on the other side of a building! The developer moves the local fan (at the hood) to the roof, to reduce lost heat/AC. Aluminum vents corrode, 5 floors (other companies) complain of odours, aluminum oxide builds up, and of course, there is insufficient ventilation for safe operation under the hood and the health of the building is questioned. Lab operations are suspended. 2 of 10 years into lease in a cu$tomized lab/office, and the lab cannot be used. Lesson: When designing a lab, hire a qualified engineer(s) and don't overlook anything. This person(s) must ensure that the system is properly installed. Hope this will help somebody in the future. John ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 07:17:41 EDT Reply-To: Labsafe@aol.com Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Labsafe@AOL.COM Subject: New Lab Safety Web Site MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subj: New Laboratory Safety Web Site Date: 99-04-21 09:37:04 EDT From: labsafety@HHMI.ORG (Roberta Lima) To: LABSAFETY-L-request@SIU.EDU Dear List Administrator: We would appreciate if you would consider posting the note below to your list about "Knowing How to Practice Safe Science," an online laboratory training site for students, teachers, and researchers. The site includes an interactive quiz that guides the user through laboratory safety practices and problems. Originally created for Howard Hughes Medical Institute researchers, the site is now available to all laboratory users as a public service. We believe this message would be of interest to your list members. If you have any questions or concerns please e-mail us at labsafety@hhmi.org. Thanks for your time and consideration. Andi McCarthy and Roberta Lima ----------- Acid spills, fires, and other hazards are everyday concerns in a modern laboratory. Learning how to react in the face of these situations is the purpose of a new laboratory training Web site "Knowing How to Practice Safe Science." This new site, at , shows students, teachers, and research scientists how to act safely in a laboratory, and then challenges them to react quickly when problems arise. The site can be easily adapted to assist an individual's interest and research, and includes an interactive quiz that rates the user's safe practice knowledge. The site was created for Howard Hughes Medical Institute (HHMI) researchers with the intent of making it available as a public service to all laboratory researchers. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 08:42:54 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Julie O'Brien Subject: Requirements for Flammable Storage Cabinets Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Does anyone have a copy of NFPA 30? I am needing more information about the construction of flammable storage cabinets, which is supposed to be in Section 4-3 of NFPA 30, Flammable and Combustible Liquids Code. I know that there is a requirement that flammable cabinets be self-closing, but I need a copy of the official code to make my point. If anyone could make a copy of the appropriate section & fax it to me, I would greatly appreciate it. Thanks! Julie O'Brien Chemist Archimica (Florida), Inc. PO Box 1466 Gainesville, FL 32602 352-376-8246 ext. 232 Fax 352-373-7503 afn35210@afn.org Education/Exhibits Committee Volunteer EXPO The Children's Museum of Gainesville PO Box 5951 Gainesville, FL 32627 ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 09:01:07 -0600 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Joe Chase Subject: Re: Requirements for Flammable Storage Cabinets Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii If it is a requirement that Flammable Cabinets have to be self-closing, what market are the manual-closing cabinets being sold to, since I see they are still readily available? ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 10:28:17 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Julie O'Brien Subject: Re: Requirements for Flammable Storage Cabinets Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >If it is a requirement that Flammable Cabinets have to be self-closing, what >market are the manual-closing cabinets being sold to, since I see they are still >readily available? Thanks to Jeff Rubin for reminding me that my request would violate copyright laws. Oops. I was wrong. The NFPA does not mention self-closing cabinets in their regulation, nor does OSHA. However, supposedly the Uniform Fire Code 79.202 does. Julie O'Brien Chemist Archimica (Florida), Inc. PO Box 1466 Gainesville, FL 32602 352-376-8246 ext. 232 Fax 352-373-7503 afn35210@afn.org Education/Exhibits Committee Volunteer EXPO The Children's Museum of Gainesville PO Box 5951 Gainesville, FL 32627 ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 08:49:58 -0700 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Nick Spare Subject: Re: Requirements for Flammable Storage Cabinets MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi all (and Julie in particular) I was also under the impression that flammable cabinets had to be self-closing, however, NFPA 30 Section 4-3.3 (b) states: "Metal (flammable) storage cabinets that are constructedin the follow manner shall be acceptable........... The door shall be provided with a three-point latch arrangement.....". Nothing is mentioned about self-closing. Does anyone have further information that I am missing? Note also that all NFPA Codes can be ordered by phone from 1-800-344-3555. In my expereince the people taking the orders are polite and efficient. Books are received in ~ 10 days. Nick Spare Pilot Chemical Co. -----Original Message----- From: Julie O'Brien To: LABSAFETY-L@SIU.EDU Date: Thursday, April 22, 1999 6:54 AM Subject: Requirements for Flammable Storage Cabinets >Does anyone have a copy of NFPA 30? I am needing more information about the >construction of flammable storage cabinets, which is supposed to be in >Section 4-3 of NFPA 30, Flammable and Combustible Liquids Code. I know that >there is a requirement that flammable cabinets be self-closing, but I need a >copy of the official code to make my point. If anyone could make a copy of >the appropriate section & fax it to me, I would greatly appreciate it. Thanks! > >Julie O'Brien >Chemist >Archimica (Florida), Inc. >PO Box 1466 >Gainesville, FL 32602 >352-376-8246 ext. 232 >Fax 352-373-7503 >afn35210@afn.org > >Education/Exhibits Committee Volunteer >EXPO The Children's Museum of Gainesville >PO Box 5951 >Gainesville, FL 32627 ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 11:37:53 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "Rajan, John B." Subject: Re: explosions MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Bob, when you get any more news about the most recent explosion in Allentown, PA, would you please send me some info? Whenever possible, I like to use real life examples in our monthly safety meetings to drive home a point. Thank you John Rajan -----Original Message----- From: Bob Burns [mailto:rburns@BIGFOOT.COM] Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 1999 9:09 AM To: LABSAFETY-L@SIU.EDU Subject: explosions Another chemical plant explosion in the Allentown area today. Coincidentally, the March 3 issue of Chemical Week just hit my desk- nice little article and photo on the last one. Still no cause given, except that PA people said it likely came from improper mixing of hydroxylamine and KOH. Company disagrees. Does that sound likely to anyone? Bob "SEMPER ADVENTURUS!!!" Robert L. Burns R&D Group Leader Specialty Chemicals Division RUETGERS Organics Corporation 201 Struble Road State College, PA 16801 phone 814-231-9214 fax 815 333 4805 email rburns@bigfoot.com ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 12:11:25 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "Dr. Linda A. Swihart" Subject: Copperhead Chemical Co explosion In-Reply-To: <408C59EF36D6D111ACF500A0C92DEA19AEC44C@cmtnts3> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" 4/21/99 - 2 WORKERS DIE IN BLAST AT PLANT full story at http://www.mcall.com/cgi-bin/slwebsto.cgi?DBLIST=mc99&DOCNUM=15287 Two workers blending nitroglycerin and other compounds for a common pain-relieving heart medication were killed in an explosion Tuesday at the Copperhead Chemical Co. Inc. plant near Tamaqua. The explosion around 7:30 a.m. in a building about 1-1/2 miles from the plant entrance was the 17th at the plant since 1959, when it was Schuylkill County's biggest employer and its explosives were used to build some of the nation's interstate highways. There are at least a couple more. Go to the Morning Call's archive search at http://www.mcall.com/library/search.htm and use the search term explosion. Linda At 11:37 AM 4/22/99 -0500, you wrote: >Bob, >when you get any more news about the most recent explosion in Allentown, PA, >would you please send me some info? Whenever possible, I like to use real >life examples in our monthly safety meetings to drive home a point. Thank >you >John Rajan > >-----Original Message----- >From: Bob Burns [mailto:rburns@BIGFOOT.COM] >Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 1999 9:09 AM >To: LABSAFETY-L@SIU.EDU >Subject: explosions > > >Another chemical plant explosion in the Allentown area today. > >Coincidentally, the March 3 issue of Chemical Week just hit my desk- nice >little article and photo on the last one. Still no cause given, except that >PA people said it likely came from improper mixing of hydroxylamine and KOH. >Company disagrees. > >Does that sound likely to anyone? > >Bob > >"SEMPER ADVENTURUS!!!" > >Robert L. Burns >R&D Group Leader >Specialty Chemicals Division >RUETGERS Organics Corporation >201 Struble Road >State College, PA 16801 >phone 814-231-9214 >fax 815 333 4805 >email rburns@bigfoot.com > ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 10:45:47 -0700 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Debbie Decker Subject: Re: Requirements for Flammable Storage Cabinets In-Reply-To: <199904221242.IAA20813@freenet4.afn.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 08:42 AM 4/22/99 -0400, you wrote: >Does anyone have a copy of NFPA 30? I am needing more information about the >construction of flammable storage cabinets, which is supposed to be in >Section 4-3 of NFPA 30, Flammable and Combustible Liquids Code. I know that >there is a requirement that flammable cabinets be self-closing, but I need a >copy of the official code to make my point. If anyone could make a copy of >the appropriate section & fax it to me, I would greatly appreciate it. Thanks! Found in the Uniform Fire Code - the citation (the one you gave is not quite correct) is 7902.5.9. Section 7902.5.9.3.2 states that "Doors shall be well fitted, self-closing and equipped with a latch." If you still need a fax copy, let me know. Deb. Debbie M. Decker, Health and Safety Specialist Environmental Health and Safety University of California, Davis 1 Shields Ave. Davis, CA 95616 (530)754-7964 (530)752-1493 dmdecker@ucdavis.edu ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 10:21:24 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Bill Schultz Subject: Re[2]: Requirements for Flammable Storage Cabinets MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit OSHA does not require self closing doors, see 29 CFR 1910.106(d)(3) Design, construction, and capacity of storage cabinets. I have not looked up the NFPA requirements. There are many places where NFPA guidelines need not be followed while OSHA applies anywhere there is an employee employer relationship. Therefore, there is a market for both types of cabinets depending on whose guidelines or regulations you are required to follow. I personally do not like the storage cabinets with self closing doors. Trying to place chemical containers into the cabinets while attempting to hold the door open with your hip, knee, foot or head increases the likelihood of dropping a container. Bill Schultz ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re: Requirements for Flammable Storage Cabinets Author: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List at Internet-Mail Date: 4/22/99 9:01 AM If it is a requirement that Flammable Cabinets have to be self-closing, what market are the manual-closing cabinets being sold to, since I see they are still readily available? ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 13:59:00 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "Tayman, Tammy" Subject: Re: Requirements for Flammable Storage Cabinets MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain From: Debbie Decker >Found in the Uniform Fire Code - the citation (the one you gave is not >quite correct) is 7902.5.9. Section 7902.5.9.3.2 states that "Doors >shall be well fitted, self-closing and equipped with a latch." If you >still need a fax copy, let me know. Is the UFC a mandatory or a guideline? Has it been incorporated into OSHA or other agencies as a requirement? Tammy Tayman ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 11:50:50 -0700 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Barry Rutledge Subject: Re: Requirements for Flammable Storage Cabinets In-Reply-To: <199904221807.NAA14526@saluki-mailsmtp.siu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >Is the UFC a mandatory or a guideline? Has it been incorporated into OSHA >or other agencies as a requirement? > >Tammy Tayman Tammy, In most cases, the UFC is "the" fire code. Most cities adopt it as the code or law they enforce. NFPA is a standard, not a code or a law. OSHA as you know is a law. The UFC is updated on a regular basis but most cities lag a few years behind because they have to review the code before they adopt it. For instance, I "think' San Diego has just adopted the 1997. Hope this helps, Barry Kenneth "Barry" Rutledge Senior Safety Specialist The Scripps Research Inst. La Jolla, CA ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 11:51:34 -0700 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Debbie Decker Subject: Re: Requirements for Flammable Storage Cabinets In-Reply-To: <199904221807.NAA14526@saluki-mailsmtp.siu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 01:59 PM 4/22/99 -0400, Tammy Tayman wrote: >From: Debbie Decker > >>Found in the Uniform Fire Code - the citation (the one you gave is not >>quite correct) is 7902.5.9. Section 7902.5.9.3.2 states that "Doors >>shall be well fitted, self-closing and equipped with a latch." If you >>still need a fax copy, let me know. > >Is the UFC a mandatory or a guideline? Has it been incorporated into OSHA >or other agencies as a requirement? Nothing to do with OSHA - this is required by our Local Authority Having Jurisdiction over the use and storage of hazardous materials (Fire Dept here, County Environmental Management or Public Health Divisions, elsewhere). For the privelage of using hazardous materials, we are required to use and store hazardous materials in compliance with the Uniform Building Code and the Uniform Fire Code (and you thought you just had to comply with OSHA and the haz waste stuff ). The UFC is incorporated into the California Code of Regulations as Title 24 (I think - memory isn't what it used to be). This is a national code and, as far as I know, required nationwide, as is the Uniform Building Code (with ammendments for California and the fact that one day, we'll slide off into the Pacific). You think the OSHA regs are tough to wade through - yeesh - the UFC is excrutiating! And always subject to the interpretation of the Fire Dude/Dudette on duty (who may or may not know anything about haz mats). Hope this helps, Deb. Debbie M. Decker, Health and Safety Specialist Environmental Health and Safety University of California, Davis 1 Shields Ave. Davis, CA 95616 (530)754-7964 (530)752-1493 dmdecker@ucdavis.edu ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 12:58:59 -0600 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "Greene, Ben" Subject: Re: Re[2]: Requirements for Flammable Storage Cabinets MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Some of the self closing cabinets have clips on the closing actuators that can lock them temporarily in the open position. However, the idea of having a heavy metal door swing shut on a glass bottle or on your body is not appealing. Also, some of the larger, pre-fab chemical storage buildings have self closing doors. I do not know if their closing mechanisms can be defeated. I have worked with one of these buildings and procedurally, had one person holding the door open while another person accessed the interior. This was, of course, after first ensuring the lighting and ventilation systems were on; even having the chance of a person getting stuck inside and perhaps not being able to find the door handle from the inside to get out wasn't worth the risk. Ben Greene, Ph.D AlliedSignal Las Cruces, NM 88004 ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 14:23:15 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Julie O'Brien Subject: Re: Requirements for Flammable Storage Cabinets Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >Is the UFC a mandatory or a guideline? Has it been incorporated into OSHA >or other agencies as a requirement? > My understanding is (and I could be very wrong about this) that UFC is enforced as the building code by some local fire departments in certain regions of the country. It is used in place of NFPA standards. Julie O'Brien Chemist Archimica (Florida), Inc. PO Box 1466 Gainesville, FL 32602 352-376-8246 ext. 232 Fax 352-373-7503 afn35210@afn.org Education/Exhibits Committee Volunteer EXPO The Children's Museum of Gainesville PO Box 5951 Gainesville, FL 32627 ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 15:42:16 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "Chang, Jim C" Subject: Re: Requirements for Flammable Storage Cabinets MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Tammy The Uniform Fire Code is the code that the authority having jurisdiction will use. In these scenarios, it is mandatory. The UFC is in force primarily in the western US and Mid West. In Maryland (I'm guessing from your email address), I think that you might be using BOCA or Southern Standard codes. Jim C. -----Original Message----- From: Tayman, Tammy [SMTP:ttayman@MC.CC.MD.US] Sent: Thursday, April 22, 1999 1:59 PM To: LABSAFETY-L@SIU.EDU Subject: Re: Requirements for Flammable Storage Cabinets From: Debbie Decker >Found in the Uniform Fire Code - the citation (the one you gave is not >quite correct) is 7902.5.9. Section 7902.5.9.3.2 states that "Doors >shall be well fitted, self-closing and equipped with a latch." If you >still need a fax copy, let me know. Is the UFC a mandatory or a guideline? Has it been incorporated into OSHA or other agencies as a requirement? Tammy Tayman ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 15:53:31 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "Stoll, Ilse (Ilse)" Subject: Re: explosions Comments: To: "Rajan, John B." MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain The local paper in Allentown showed yesterday the track record of the company which used to be Atlas Powder. With all indicents and accidents they listed under cause "cause unknown". This points to an excellent example of the value of good root cause analyses, if someone wants to use this in their safety teachings. The root cause to the explosion may have been the lack of thorough root cause analyses in the past. Ilse Stoll Allentown ---------- From: Rajan, John B. [SMTP:rajan@CMT.ANL.GOV] Sent: Thursday, April 22, 1999 12:38 PM To: LABSAFETY-L@SIU.EDU Subject: Re: explosions Bob, when you get any more news about the most recent explosion in Allentown, PA, would you please send me some info? Whenever possible, I like to use real life examples in our monthly safety meetings to drive home a point. Thank you John Rajan -----Original Message----- From: Bob Burns [mailto:rburns@BIGFOOT.COM] Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 1999 9:09 AM To: LABSAFETY-L@SIU.EDU Subject: explosions Another chemical plant explosion in the Allentown area today. Coincidentally, the March 3 issue of Chemical Week just hit my desk- nice little article and photo on the last one. Still no cause given, except that PA people said it likely came from improper mixing of hydroxylamine and KOH. Company disagrees. Does that sound likely to anyone? Bob "SEMPER ADVENTURUS!!!" Robert L. Burns R&D Group Leader Specialty Chemicals Division RUETGERS Organics Corporation 201 Struble Road State College, PA 16801 phone 814-231-9214 fax 815 333 4805 email rburns@bigfoot.com ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 17:17:33 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Sharon Reed Subject: Flashpoints of Ethanol mixtures Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii I know there was a discussion thread on this a few weeks ago, about the time I joined this august group.... Specifically, I need the flashpoint of 20% ethanol in water. Alternately, I would like to know if any EtOH-H(subscript: 2)O mixture has a flashpoint of 185 F. In general, a nice chart with flashpoints of the mixture in regular increments would be handy. Closed cup vs open cup would also be interesting data to look at. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 16:42:51 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Jeff Rubin Subject: Re: Requirements for Flammable Storage Cabinets In-Reply-To: <199904221823.OAA15331@freenet4.afn.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Depending on which part of the country you're in, your fire codes are probably based on the National Fire Prevention Code (NFPA 1), Uniform Fire Code, or Southern Building Code. All are consensus standards that may be adopted as law. That assumes, of course, that you live in an area with any fire code beyond life safety. Most unincorporated areas have no fire codes. JNR >>Is the UFC a mandatory or a guideline? Has it been incorporated into OSHA >>or other agencies as a requirement? >> > >My understanding is (and I could be very wrong about this) that UFC is >enforced as the building code by some local fire departments in certain >regions of the country. It is used in place of NFPA standards. Jeff Rubin, Asst. Dean for EHS College of Natural Sciences G2500 W.C. Hogg Building University of Texas at Austin Austin, TX 78712-1199 (512) 471-6176 (O) (512) 471-4998 (F) jrubin@mail.utexas.edu http://www.utexas.edu/cons/safety/ "The opinions of Dr. Rubin are not meant to offend anyone unless otherwise specified." ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 16:51:24 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Jeff Rubin Subject: Re: Flashpoints of Ethanol mixtures In-Reply-To: <8525675B.0074790D.00@mail.pall.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit According to NFPA 325 (p. 4), 20% EtOH in water has a FP of 97°F; even a 5% solution has a FP of 144°F, so a mixture with a FP as high as 185° isn't likely. JNR >I know there was a discussion thread on this a few weeks ago, about the time I >joined this august group.... > >Specifically, I need the flashpoint of 20% ethanol in water. Alternately, I >would like to know if any EtOH-H(subscript: 2)O mixture has a flashpoint >of 185 >F. Jeff Rubin, Asst. Dean for EHS College of Natural Sciences G2500 W.C. Hogg Building University of Texas at Austin Austin, TX 78712-1199 (512) 471-6176 (O) (512) 471-4998 (F) jrubin@mail.utexas.edu http://www.utexas.edu/cons/safety/ "The opinions of Dr. Rubin are not meant to offend anyone unless otherwise specified." ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 14:30:44 -0700 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Melonee Cruse Organization: Chaffey College Subject: Re: Hazardous Materials Handling MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Hello Everyone, I hope someone can help me with a problem we have experienced on our campus. A procedure was established in our shipping and receiving warehouse that requires the warehouse workers to open all incoming packages to make sure orders are complete. This means that they must also open chemical and biological supplies. Our biology department asked, in writing, that the warehouse not open their packages because some of the items required special handling. The warehouse director ignored this request and a worker opened a package and was exposed to some material that cause them to have a rash of some type (I don't know all the details of their injury). The campus public safety office wrote up a report and claimed the material was non-toxic based on the MSDS and the quick disappearance of the workers rash. I do not work in any "safety" position on campus. Because I teach environmental technology courses I have been asked about the type of training the worker should have received and what should he do so that things will change in the warehouse. I told the staff union grievance representative that by LAW, the supervisor should have a written HazCom program in place and all the workers should be trained on handling hazardous materials (even though they do not open the chemical bottles), should be trained on PPE, and how to interpret the accompanying MSDS. They should also be trained according to IIPP. Does anyone have any suggestions on how I should write this response? I will use the California Health and Safety code and site specifically the sections that apply to HazCom and IIPP training. Is there another regulation I should quote? I am hoping that this will cause the warehouse to chance it policies and implement better training for the workers. We are a community college that is REACTIVE not PROACTIVE and many individuals on campus are trying to change that. We plan to use this to get administration to act. I hope by sharing this that others who have complained about the REACTIVE practices at their workplace (esp academia) can also make some changes. If this topic has been hashed out before, please answer privately. Melonee Cruse Chaffey Community College mcruse@chaffey.cc.ca.us ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 15:44:20 -0800 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Teresa Robertson Organization: CSU Bakersfield Subject: Eye Protection Comments: cc: trobertson@csubak.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Dear NACHO's, I've been too involved elsewhere to keep in touch with you lately, not even able to read your valuable info...but am in need of help....but please don't quote me on the chem-ed list, or any other... Ironically, I had a chem. prof. use a Jim Kaufman posting to Chem-Ed to defend his position to not use goggles in the chemistry lab. Most of the chem. dept. thinks my position, that goggles instead of safety glasses should be worn in a chem lab, is overkill. Please tell me if I am overboard. >From ChemEd...Jim Kaufman "Safety goggles (or more properly, Chemical Splash Safety Goggles) should be worn in chemistry and biology labs when there is likelihood of splash of a chemical that could injure the eye; likelihood of splash of a chemical which you do not know whether it could hurt the eye or not; and likelihood of splash of any liquid hotter than 60 degrees Celsius." The point that the prof and I were in disagreement about is Jim's use of the word "likely", which he interpreted as "probable", whereas I would think NACHOs would think goggles should be worn if splash of a chemical that could injure the eye is "possible". Specifically, the prof used the example of adjusting the pH of HEPES buffer with 3M NaOH as an instance where glasses with side-shields would be quite adequate. At the time NACHO's discussed this topic (Sept. 9,10,11,12, 1998) I was troubled also by what constitutes a "potential splash", and posed the question to the list, but received no ammo with which to convince others... Feedback please! ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 17:51:54 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Mike Pirrello Subject: Re: Hazardous Materials Handling MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Actually, the receipt of materials is still part of the transportation process and therefore the most applicable federal regulations in this case are found in 49 CFR Subpart H (172.700-172.704). These few paragraphs lay out the training requirements for "hazmat employees" (persons who "load, unload, or handle hazardous materials" per 49 CFR 171.8). Specifically, the regulations require that the hazmat employee "has knowledge of emergency response information, self-protection measures and accident prevention methods and procedures". Michael G. Pirrello, CHMM Facilities, Safety & Environmental Mgr. Trimeris, Inc. 4727 University Drive, Ste. 100 Durham, NC 27707-3485 Ph: (919) 419-6050 Fx: (919) 419-1816 Mpirrello@trimeris.com -----Original Message----- From: Melonee Cruse [mailto:mcruse@BUNNY.CHAFFEY.CC.CA.US] Sent: Friday, April 23, 1999 5:31 PM To: LABSAFETY-L@SIU.EDU Subject: Re: Hazardous Materials Handling Hello Everyone, I hope someone can help me with a problem we have experienced on our campus. A procedure was established in our shipping and receiving warehouse that requires the warehouse workers to open all incoming packages to make sure orders are complete. This means that they must also open chemical and biological supplies. Our biology department asked, in writing, that the warehouse not open their packages because some of the items required special handling. The warehouse director ignored this request and a worker opened a package and was exposed to some material that cause them to have a rash of some type (I don't know all the details of their injury). The campus public safety office wrote up a report and claimed the material was non-toxic based on the MSDS and the quick disappearance of the workers rash. I do not work in any "safety" position on campus. Because I teach environmental technology courses I have been asked about the type of training the worker should have received and what should he do so that things will change in the warehouse. I told the staff union grievance representative that by LAW, the supervisor should have a written HazCom program in place and all the workers should be trained on handling hazardous materials (even though they do not open the chemical bottles), should be trained on PPE, and how to interpret the accompanying MSDS. They should also be trained according to IIPP. Does anyone have any suggestions on how I should write this response? I will use the California Health and Safety code and site specifically the sections that apply to HazCom and IIPP training. Is there another regulation I should quote? I am hoping that this will cause the warehouse to chance it policies and implement better training for the workers. We are a community college that is REACTIVE not PROACTIVE and many individuals on campus are trying to change that. We plan to use this to get administration to act. I hope by sharing this that others who have complained about the REACTIVE practices at their workplace (esp academia) can also make some changes. If this topic has been hashed out before, please answer privately. Melonee Cruse Chaffey Community College mcruse@chaffey.cc.ca.us ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 16:39:52 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Peter Priniski Subject: Fire Extinguisher Training MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain We recently went through a hands on fire extinguisher training that involved using an A,B,C rated dry chemical extinguisher on a small hexane fire. A question was raised regarding the proper technique for putting out fires higher than ground level, such as on a lab bench or in a hood or shelf. The second question was regarding the use of Halon type extinguishers. Do the dry chemical techniques work with these devices as well? Are there training materials available that cover these topics? (ie. videos, handouts, etc.) My initial response to these questions was "When in doubt, GET OUT!" Thanks. Pete ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 15:16:37 -0700 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Melonee Cruse Organization: Chaffey College Subject: Re: Eye Protection MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit In our chemistry lab (2yr college) students must wear splash proof goggles because it is required by our insurance carrier . Check with the schools insurance group and see if they require students to wear safety goggles. Sometimes it is very hard to change old habits and beliefs. I hope you are able to convince the profs that goggles are better. Melonee Cruse Chaffey Community College mcruse@chaffey.cc.ca.us Teresa Robertson wrote: > Dear NACHO's, > > I've been too involved elsewhere to keep in touch with you lately, not > even able to read your valuable info...but am in need of help....but > please don't quote me on the chem-ed list, or any other... > > Ironically, I had a chem. prof. use a Jim Kaufman posting to Chem-Ed to > defend his position to not use goggles in the chemistry lab. Most of > the chem. dept. thinks my position, that goggles instead of safety > glasses should be worn in a chem lab, is overkill. Please tell me if I > am overboard. > > >From ChemEd...Jim Kaufman "Safety goggles (or more properly, Chemical > Splash Safety Goggles) should be worn in chemistry and biology labs > when there is likelihood of splash of a chemical that > could injure the eye; likelihood of splash of a chemical which you do > not know whether it could hurt the eye or not; and likelihood of splash > of any liquid hotter than 60 degrees Celsius." > > The point that the prof and I were in disagreement about is Jim's use > of the word "likely", which he interpreted as "probable", whereas I > would think NACHOs would think goggles should be worn if splash of a > chemical that could injure the eye is "possible". Specifically, the > prof used the example of adjusting the pH of HEPES buffer with 3M NaOH > as an instance where glasses with side-shields would be quite adequate. > > At the time NACHO's discussed this topic (Sept. 9,10,11,12, 1998) I was > troubled also by what constitutes a "potential splash", and posed the > question to the list, but received no ammo with which to convince > others... > > Feedback please! ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 17:11:35 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Terri Crisp Subject: goggle usage Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Teresa, Here at the University of Oklahoma and also at the regional university where I received my undergraduate degree, goggles are required in the laboratory whenever there is a potential for a splash of chemicals into the eyes. This rule extends not only to the teaching labs, but also to the research labs. In the example given by Jim Kaufman, in my opinion, there is still the potential for a splash to occur and goggles should be worn. Terri Crisp Environmental Safety Specialist University of Oklahoma 905 Asp Ave Room 112 Norman, OK 73071 email: tecrisp@ou.edu ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 17:40:30 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "Rebecca Levins, RSR Corporation" Subject: Re: Hazardous Materials Handling MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="---- =_NextPart_000_01BE8DB0.673A7F40" ------ =_NextPart_000_01BE8DB0.673A7F40 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Melonee Cruse in part writes: "Does anyone have any suggestions on how I should write this response? I will use the California Health and Safety code and site specifically the sections that apply to HazCom and IIPP training. Is there another regulation I should quote? I am hoping that this will cause the warehouse to chance it policies and implement better training for the workers. We are a community college that is REACTIVE not PROACTIVE and many individuals on campus are trying to change that." -------- OSHA's General Duty clause might be appropriate :). It's always = mentioned. If they are receiving DOT hazardous materials, they must be = trained according to it. If the biological materials could have anything = to do with blood, bodily fluids, or blood borne pathogens, you have = blood borne pathogen training. They should also have readily accessible the appropriate PPE. If they = also ship out hazardous waste, training is required (I think under RCRA = as well as HazWoper, but this is a shaky area for me). If you want proactive, also try suggesting they implement a program that = will provide proactive actions. Fixing this problem is great, but how do = you determine the next one before it happens? Give them a way to look = beyond the warehouse incident and look at some sort of 'total quality' = in the EH&S field. Don't just suggest that they become proactive. Something to know about toxic is that it is a specific term under Haz = Com. You may have something that is a hazardous material, and yet is not = 'toxic'. Some of your carcinogens and sensitizers fall into this = category as well as irritants. Toxic under Haz Com is having an oral = LD50 of 500mg/kg or less (dermal less than LD50 1000mg/kg, inhalation = less than LC50 2000ppm). It doesn't mean it isn't dangerous.=20 BTY What is IIPP?=20 Good luck, Rebecca Levins Environmental Health & Safety Compliance Specialist RSR Corporation Dallas, Texas RSRrdl@onramp.net (214) 583-0245 direct line (214) 631-6070 fax ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 16:48:06 -0600 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "Helen B. Gerhard" Subject: Glasscleaning Bath MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Hi All: I'm hoping someone can help me with this dilemma. We are needing a base/alcohol bath for cleaning alcohol. The alcohol is flammable but the base material in water is not. I need to have a mixture that is either non-combustible or combustible but not flammable. What percentages of the materials should I use? Materials: Either Sodium or Potassium Hydoxide Water to dissolve the hydroxide in Either Ethanol or Isopropyl Alcohol Any suggestions? Thanks! Helen ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 18:00:32 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "Dr. Linda A. Swihart" Subject: Re: Eye Protection In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 03:44 PM 4/23/99 -0800, you wrote: > >At the time NACHO's discussed this topic (Sept. 9,10,11,12, 1998) I was >troubled also by what constitutes a "potential splash", and posed the >question to the list, but received no ammo with which to convince >others... We regard "potential splash" (and likely, and probable) as an open container of liquid anywhere near a person. There are some procedures of course in which the use of spashable (spashible? :-) liquid is limited to - opening the stationary container (in the hood) - inserting a pipetter (in the hood) - withdrawing microliters of liquid (in the hood) - discharging the microliters into other stationary vessel (in the hood) When these (research staff) people ask me if they "have to" wear their splash goggles to do this I tell them that their risks are minimal compared to the person preparing 5 L of 6N HCl from conc HCl, but that their risks are not zero. Undergrads, on the other hand, HAVE TO, as in they are kicked out of the teaching labs and given a zero for the lesson if caught without their goggles (on their eyes) while the loab is in progress, whether they are working with a splash hazard or not. Teaching Assistants who are caught not observing this rule are given a nasty verbal going-over. ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 16:04:50 -0700 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Teresa Robertson Organization: CSU Bakersfield Subject: Re: Hazardous Materials Handling Comments: cc: trobertson@csubak.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit LABSAFETY-L@siu.edu,.internet writes: >BTY What is IIPP? Illness and Injury Prevention Program, required by Cal-OSHA Teresa Robertson, CCHO CSUB ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 18:27:14 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Jeff Rubin Subject: Re: Eye Protection In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" No worries on goggles in teaching labs - it's required and enforced in ours (see below). Research labs are a different story. As I told Teresa off-line, I'm happy if we have people wearing some type of eye protection; we try to reinforce the need for goggles in the higher-risk labs but it's an uphill battle (kind of like sandals...). I wanted to share a system that our supervisor of undergrad chem labs uses: as she puts it, "humiliation." A student caught not wearing goggles in lab (which generally means wearing them up, or "protecting the forehead") gets to wear a fface-mask over goggles for that and the next lab, for all to see. Students attired improperly get to wear a tyvek "bunny suit" (I don't know if there's a sign attached), and students caught wearing open-toed or open-heeled shoes must wear the "Boots of Shame" - it works! Not only that, but the prof/lab supervisor is very popular with the students! Onward, JNR Jeff Rubin, Asst. Dean for EHS College of Natural Sciences G2500 W.C. Hogg Building University of Texas at Austin Austin, TX 78712-1199 (512) 471-6176 (O) (512) 471-4998 (F) jrubin@mail.utexas.edu http://www.utexas.edu/cons/safety/ "The opinions of Dr. Rubin are not meant to offend anyone unless otherwise specified." ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 16:34:55 -0700 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Gordon Miller Subject: Re: Glasscleaning Bath In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" We've been through this recently. Raoult's Law (I hope the spelling is right) tells one that the LEL percentage for ethanol is unattainable at 1:1 by volume. A similar calc could be made for other alcohols. Gordon Miller, CIH miller22@llnl.gov ----------------------------- >Hi All: > >I'm hoping someone can help me with this dilemma. We are needing a >base/alcohol bath for cleaning alcohol. The alcohol is flammable but the >base material in water is not. I need to have a mixture that is either >non-combustible or combustible but not flammable. What percentages of the >materials should I use? > >Materials: Either Sodium or Potassium Hydoxide > Water to dissolve the hydroxide in > Either Ethanol or Isopropyl Alcohol > > >Any suggestions? > >Thanks! > >Helen ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 16:38:47 -0700 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Gordon Miller Subject: Re: Eye Protection In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I hope the el cheapo portless goggles aren't involved. They fog readily. I've recommended safety spectacles with full sideshields under face shields rather than have people suffer portless goggles. But ported/covered port goggles are easier and should be tried, especially for caustics. I hope HF isn't in use in freshman and sophomore labs, but I'd insist on gogles if it was. Gordon Miller, CIH miller22@llnl.gov ------------------------- >Dear NACHO's, > >I've been too involved elsewhere to keep in touch with you lately, not >even able to read your valuable info...but am in need of help....but >please don't quote me on the chem-ed list, or any other... > >Ironically, I had a chem. prof. use a Jim Kaufman posting to Chem-Ed to >defend his position to not use goggles in the chemistry lab. Most of >the chem. dept. thinks my position, that goggles instead of safety >glasses should be worn in a chem lab, is overkill. Please tell me if I >am overboard. > >>From ChemEd...Jim Kaufman "Safety goggles (or more properly, Chemical >Splash Safety Goggles) should be worn in chemistry and biology labs >when there is likelihood of splash of a chemical that >could injure the eye; likelihood of splash of a chemical which you do >not know whether it could hurt the eye or not; and likelihood of splash >of any liquid hotter than 60 degrees Celsius." > >The point that the prof and I were in disagreement about is Jim's use >of the word "likely", which he interpreted as "probable", whereas I >would think NACHOs would think goggles should be worn if splash of a >chemical that could injure the eye is "possible". Specifically, the >prof used the example of adjusting the pH of HEPES buffer with 3M NaOH >as an instance where glasses with side-shields would be quite adequate. > > >At the time NACHO's discussed this topic (Sept. 9,10,11,12, 1998) I was >troubled also by what constitutes a "potential splash", and posed the >question to the list, but received no ammo with which to convince >others... > >Feedback please! ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 20:21:18 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Don Abramowitz Subject: Re: Eye Protection Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >I was >troubled also by what constitutes a "potential splash", and posed the >question to the list, but received no ammo with which to convince >others... My sense is that "potential splash" can and will be debated infinitely in the academic realm. My argument in training classes regarding goggles vs. glasses, which has thus far not been challenged by participants (out loud, anyway - seems like everything else is!) goes something like: The splash potential in some laboratories may be quite remote, BUT: If you're called on the carpet (carpet of, say, a courtroom, parent's home, lawyer's office, sr. administrator, etc.) because someone managed to injure their eye by a chemical splash, in your lab, while wearing safety glasses in lieu of goggles, no eye protection manufacturer nor published guideline will support your decision to have chosen safety glasses. (Hopefully, I use shorter sentences when I actually say it.) Don ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Donald Abramowitz, CIH Occupational and Environmental Safety Officer Bryn Mawr College | Swarthmore College 101 N. Merion Avenue | 500 College Avenue Bryn Mawr, PA 19010 | Swarthmore PA 19081 ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 23:13:03 EDT Reply-To: Vajlm@aol.com Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Jim Mudd Subject: Re: Hazardous Materials Handling MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Melonee, I believe that the warehouse workers would also be covered by the training requirements under DOT's hazardous materials regulations which includes hazard recognition. Jim Mudd ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 24 Apr 1999 10:58:11 EDT Reply-To: Labsafe@aol.com Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Labsafe@AOL.COM Subject: Re: Eye Protection MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 99-04-23 17:47:06 EDT, you write: << The point that the prof and I were in disagreement about is Jim's use of the word "likely", which he interpreted as "probable", whereas I would think NACHOs would think goggles should be worn if splash of a chemical that could injure the eye is "possible". Specifically, the prof used the example of adjusting the pH of HEPES buffer with 3M NaOH as an instance where glasses with side-shields would be quite adequate. >> Hi NACHOs, OSHA (29CFR1910.133) says, "Protective eye and face equipment shall be requried where there is a reasonable probability of injury that can be prevented by such equipment." and then later ... "Design, construction, testing, and use of devices .... shall be in accordance with .... (ANSI) Z87.1.... " Therefore, since in using 3M NAOH there is a reasonable probability of a splash that could harm the eye both OSHA and recommended good practice would say use a chemical splash goggle. Safety glasses with side shields would not be adequate in my opinion. It is important for the employer's chemical hygiene plan to make it reasonable clear when various PPE are necessary and required. ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 08:03:53 +1200 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Tony Haggerty Subject: Re: Flashpoints of Ethanol mixtures MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000E_01BE8EF2.2951A940" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000E_01BE8EF2.2951A940 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sharon Ethanol/Water Flash point table. ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 12:12:22 -0500 Reply-To: "swiki@bihs.net" Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Swiki Anderson Subject: Re: Corroding fume-hood/vents MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Now, not right off hand. When I have some time, however I will go to Texas A&M library and look thing up. When I worked in the chemical industry (Shell chem, Deer Park, TX) we had a 1-inch guide of chemicals vs. metals,plastics,coatings that was excellent...Unfortunately I loaned the blasted thing out and can not recall to whom and what the name of it was. As I need it to from time to time, I will chase it down. Swiki -----Original Message----- From: Thomas J. Shelley [SMTP:tjs1@CORNELL.EDU] Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 1999 9:41 AM To: LABSAFETY-L@SIU.EDU Subject: Re: Corroding fume-hood/vents On 4/21 Swiki Anderson wrote: >Fume hoods and fume hood duct work that serve them can be made of Al, >steel, PVC, Ss steel, or the other materials for that matter. ...much >deleted.... >ducting material that serve a hood; the American Society for Metals >publishes some excellent guides for metal versus chemical selections. Swiki--This is very good information and concisely stated. I have been dealing with many of the same engineering and chemical use issues over the past few years and I agree with your conclusions. I have some great photos of high grade stainless steel ductwork only 2 years old that was turned into swiss cheese by hot sulfuic acid. How can we reach the American Society for Metals. Do you have a web site address or phone number? Thanks. Tom ********************************************************* Tom Shelley, Chemical Hygiene Officer, Cornell University Department of Environmental Health and Safety, 125 Humphreys Service Building, Ithaca, NY 14853. (607) 255-4288 tjs1@cornell.edu ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 06:22:22 EDT Reply-To: Labsafe@aol.com Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Labsafe@AOL.COM Subject: Re: Lab Safety Shoes Comments: To: SAFETY@list.uvm.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 99-04-26 00:05:41 EDT, you write: << Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 14:25:14 -0400 From: Brickman Subject: Re: lab safety shoes I believe 1910.1450 precludes the use of sandals, perforated shoes, or sneakers. "Prudent Practices for Handling Hazardous Chemicals in Laboratories" also advises against "cloth sneakers." Hope this helps, Chuck Brickman >> My reading of the Lab Standard does not reveal any requirement with respect to shoes. The appendix may contain a recommendation, but this is not a requirement. Recognized good practice, of course, includes a prohibition on the use of sandals, perforated shoes, or sneakers. It's just not a requirement of 29CFR1910.1450. LSW will offer nine, one-day lab safety seminars in New York State (April 26-May 14) and a two-day short course in Nebraska (May 19-20). .... Jim Kaufman ***************************************************** James A. Kaufman, Director The Laboratory Safety Workshop Safety in Science Education 192 Worcester Road, Natick, MA 01760 508-647-1900 Fax: 508-647-0062 labsafe@aol.com http://www.labsafety.org/ LSW is a national non-profit educational organization dedicated to making health and safety an integral and important part of science education. Free copies of our Laboratory Safety Guidelines, seminar schedule, Publications List, AV-Lending Library List, and membership information are available on request. The LABSAFETY-L discussion list is a public service of LSW. ****************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 08:01:04 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Bill Schultz Subject: Re[2]: Hazardous Materials Handling MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit 49 CFR 171.8 defines a HAZMAT employee as an individual who during the course of employment, loads, unloads, or handles hazardous materials. The warehouse workers you mention would fit this definition. 49 CFR 172.702(d) states that a hazmat employer shall ensure that each of its hazmat employees is tested by appropriate means (whatever that is) on the training subjects covered in 172.704. 49 CFR 172.704(b)(iii) states that HAZCOM training may be used to meet the general awareness/familiarization training of this section. HAZCOM training will not cover the fuction-specific training required under section 172.704(a)(20. The HAZCOM standard 29 CFR 1910.1200(b)(4) has less stringent requirements for warehouse workers who only handle sealed (my interpretation is that it doesn't matter that you open the box as long as you don't open the container) containers. 29 CFR 1910.1200(b)(4)(iii) states: "Employers shall ensure that employees are provided with information and training in accordance with paragraph (h) of this section (except for the location and availability of the written hazard communication program under paragraph (h)(2)(iii) of this section), to the extent necessary to protect them in the event of a spill or leak of a hazardous chemical from a sealed container. Our warehouse workers are also required to open every carton that comes into our facility to verify correctness of the material with two exceptions. Outer wrappings on packages containing infectious materials or toxins are never opened in the warehouse area. Packages containing infectious materials are signed for by the researcher they are addressed to who has the responsibility to take the package to the appropriate laboratory and opening it in a Biological Safety Cabinet. All toxins are signed for by our Toxic Substance Control Officer who will take the package to the appropriate laboratory and open it in either a chemical fume hood or Biological Safety Cabinet depending on the contents. Occasionally our warehouse employees will open the outer packaging on a shipment and discover a broken container inside or a container will be dropped and broken. In either situation the employees are instructed to leave the warehouse and notify the Chemical Hygiene Office. That may sound like overkill but we have over 5,000 individual chemicals in our institute and there is no way we can expect the warehouse personnel to know the hazards of the chemicals that pass through the warehouse. Bill Schultz ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 11:17:34 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Janeen LaPierre Subject: Re: Hazardous Materials Handling Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Hello Mellone and all. This is a common problem I think in many educational setting. The problem we have here is no central receiving area. So, while we have trained our mail room staff others on campus may be asked to sign for packages, especially on the weekend. These packages may be Biohazards, chemical hazards, or just expensive computer equipment that should not be left in a hall until Monday. I'm in full agreement that your warehouse folks should not be opening stuff for Bio and Chem. These packages need to be delivered to the appropriate departments where they can be unpacked properly. From a lab coordinator point of view, I would be very concerned with materials being broken or otherwise rendered useless by improper Handling. The CHO in me says that this is a bad practice since hazardous or otherwise sensitive materials are usually packaged very specifically to insure their safe arrival at a lab. If warehouse folks are opening them up, they then need to ensure proper transportation ! packaging is being met. If they have to transport over a public road way on your campus, they must meet DOT regs too. We have a small campus but there is a public road way that connects the whole thing. We have trained our folks on recognition of hazards, to make sure they know what they are signing for and who to contact when hazardous material come in. I would strongly erg your warehouse to let lab personnel determine if their orders are complete or not. For what its worth, Janeen. :):):):):):):):):):):):) Janeen Lapierre, CHO College of Osteopathic Medicine University of New England 11 Hills Beach Road Biddeford, ME 04005 E-Mail: JLaPierre@MAILBOX.UNE.EDU Phone: (207) 283-0170 ext 2446 Opinions are mine and not those of UNE. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 09:18:50 -0600 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "Helen B. Gerhard" Subject: Re: Glasscleaning Bath MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Hi All: Based on the Chart provided by Tony Haggerty, a w/w of 10 indicates a FP of 120*F which is a Class II Combustible. A w/w of 5 indicates a FP of 144*F which is a Class III-A Combustible. Thus, I am assuming that a w/w of ethanol of 10 or less would fit my needs. Is this assumption correct? Tony: Do you have a similar chart for Isopropyl Alcohol? Thanks! Helen >Hi All: > >I'm hoping someone can help me with this dilemma. We are needing a >base/alcohol bath for cleaning alcohol. The alcohol is flammable but the >base material in water is not. I need to have a mixture that is either >non-combustible or combustible but not flammable. What percentages of the >materials should I use? > >Materials: Either Sodium or Potassium Hydoxide > Water to dissolve the hydroxide in > Either Ethanol or Isopropyl Alcohol > > >Any suggestions? > >Thanks! > >Helen ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 11:40:47 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Janeen LaPierre Subject: Re: Eye Protection Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit >Snip< The splash potential in some laboratories may be quite remote, BUT: If you're called on the carpet (carpet of, say, a courtroom, parent's home, lawyer's office, sr. administrator, etc.) because someone managed to injure their eye by a chemical splash, in your lab, while wearing safety glasses in lieu of goggles, no eye protection manufacturer nor published guideline will support your decision to have chosen safety glasses. (Hopefully, I use shorter sentences when I actually say it.) >Snip< Nice argument, Don. I will add it to my list. Thanks, Janeen. :):):):):):):):):):):):) Janeen Lapierre, CHO College of Osteopathic Medicine University of New England 11 Hills Beach Road Biddeford, ME 04005 E-Mail: JLaPierre@MAILBOX.UNE.EDU Phone: (207) 283-0170 ext 2446 Opinions are mine and not those of UNE. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 12:00:47 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Mike Pirrello Subject: Re: Hazardous Materials Handling MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Keep in mind that at least for infectious substances, IATA 1.3.3.1 requires arrangements to be made for receiving the material prior to shipping. This is a regulatory burden that ultimately falls to some extent on laboratory personnel, and therefore they need to know of the requirement. If you're getting biohazardous packages in that are just "sitting in the hall," then you may have more than an institutional problem, you may be out of compliance. Michael G. Pirrello, CHMM Facilities, Safety & Environmental Mgr. Trimeris, Inc. 4727 University Drive, Ste. 100 Durham, NC 27707-3485 Ph: (919) 419-6050 Fx: (919) 419-1816 Mpirrello@trimeris.com ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 09:29:31 -0700 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Teresa Robertson Organization: CSU Bakersfield Subject: Re: Eye Protection Comments: cc: trobertson@csubak.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Dear NACHOs, I fretted over the weekend about my terminal foot-in-mouth disease, so am very thankful to all of you who sent support my way. I would not have sent my memo, if I'd given it more thought, and apologize if anyone was offended. I contribute my thoughtlessness to temporary insanity, brought on by being subjected to too many "life is not fair" events. There are a number of reasons for my regret, of importance to our group is that I fear those who do not know I consider Jim Kaufman a mentor, might take part of my message in a way that I did not intend, and meant for the usage of the word "ironic" to convey my true intention. I admire Jim, and salute him for the advancements in providing safer employment and safer schools and he has brought about. Teresa ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 14:18:29 -0400 Reply-To: fullert@bc.eduANDERSAB Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Thomas Fuller Subject: "POLY-DOLLY" Comments: cc: ARTHUR ANDERSEN 1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Does anyone have any experience with the use of a "POLY-DOLLY" mobile dispensing station? This device is available from Lab Safety Supply. My concern is static charge build-up while dispensing acetone from a 55-Gallon drum into a 1 Gallon glass or other nonconductive container. Is it necessary to bond the nonconductive container? Thank you. ---------------------- Thomas Fuller fullert@bc.edu Boston College ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 14:08:03 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Jeff Rubin Subject: Re: Fire Extinguisher Training In-Reply-To: <337AD0B4DAE8D111AEEF00A0C99DB2D60FD37D@smtexpo.radian.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Pete, One doesn't find many hand-held Halon extinguishers around these days. It's important to realize that Halon and similar compounds can be deadly to people during fire conditions. Much like the CCl4 extinguishers of yesteryear, CFCs thermally decompose and create very toxic by-products (e.g., halogenide gases, phosgene). In short, using a Halon extinguisher in a relatively enclosed space without respiratory protection may be hazardous to your health. As far as burning spills on benches and shelves, this sounds like what's called a 3-dimensional fire. Foam is the extinguishing agent of choice for such incidents. I asked another member of my fire dept., and we agree that a dry chem extinguisher might be effective if the material is not running offthe shelf or bench, AND the dry chem can be banked of a wall or ceiling. Dry ice might work as well under similar conditions, depending on fire size. Remember that fighting an "elevated" fire with a pressurized extinguisher might spray fuel (burning or not) around, including on the person trying to put the fire out. Two sources for fire extinguisher training material: 1) AFD; 2) NFPA. Videos, pamphlets, the works. You also might try your local fire dept. (Pete - AFD loves Radian!). Your initial response is correct. Here is a consensus (NFPA, etc.) list of factors to consider when deciding whether to fight or run: - Improper extinguisher for type of fire or uncertain about same - Fire has spread beyond initial source or is bigger than extinguisher can handle - Fire threatens to cut off escape - Fire is between extinguisher and would-be user - Extinguisher is not fully charged - Heavy fuel load or other hazardous materials directly threatened by fire - Toxic combustion products already threatening room occupants - Lack of training in use of extinguisher or uncertainty about ability to use it (this includes physical ability to lift and manipulate it) Remember - fire spreads VERY quickly; it grows exponentially, especially in the first few minutes of combustion. Onward, JNR >We recently went through a hands on fire extinguisher training that involved >using an A,B,C rated dry chemical extinguisher on a small hexane fire. A >question was raised regarding the proper technique for putting out fires >higher than ground level, such as on a lab bench or in a hood or shelf. > >The second question was regarding the use of Halon type extinguishers. Do >the dry chemical techniques work with these devices as well? > >Are there training materials available that cover these topics? (ie. >videos, handouts, etc.) > >My initial response to these questions was "When in doubt, GET OUT!" > >Thanks. > >Pete Jeff Rubin, Asst. Dean for EHS College of Natural Sciences G2500 W.C. Hogg Building University of Texas at Austin Austin, TX 78712-1199 (512) 471-6176 (O) (512) 471-4998 (F) jrubin@mail.utexas.edu http://www.utexas.edu/cons/safety/ "The opinions of Dr. Rubin are not meant to offend anyone unless otherwise specified." ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 07:31:49 -0700 Reply-To: Marc Neuffer Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Marc Neuffer Organization: SafetyInfo.Com Subject: For those with safety duties MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_008E_01BE9080.03219A20" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_008E_01BE9080.03219A20 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Just added 25+ new pages to http://www.safetyinfo.com -> Spanish Language Safety Talks -> Lifting Analysis Worksheet -> 3 New Training Handouts on Respirators -> Weekly Supervisor Brief - Working Surfaces -> Weekly Safety Poster - Report Safety Hazards Also a new feature - Weekly Editorial (Counter Points Accepted) Regards & Best Wishes Marc Neuffer Safety Info.Com ------=_NextPart_000_008E_01BE9080.03219A20 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Just added 25+ new pages to http://www.safetyinfo.com
-> Spanish Language Safety Talks
-> Lifting Analysis Worksheet
-> 3 New Training Handouts on = Respirators
-> Weekly Supervisor Brief - Working = Surfaces
-> Weekly Safety Poster - Report Safety=20 Hazards
 
Also a new feature - Weekly Editorial (Counter = Points=20 Accepted)
 
Regards & Best Wishes
Marc Neuffer
Safety = Info.Com
------=_NextPart_000_008E_01BE9080.03219A20-- ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 10:52:30 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Don Abramowitz Subject: Blood-borne pathogens and plumbers? In-Reply-To: <21A08BD4481AD1118D8900805F29067D3406A2@TRIMERISEX1> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Greetings, especially to those whose health and safety responsibilities go beyond the laboratory: We are considering inclusion of our plumbers in our Blood-borne pathogen exposure control plan, based on their potential exposure to raw sewage when working with waste lines and sewer back-ups. I've seen conflicting statements in OSHA letters of interpretation and other schools BBP plans as to whether plumbers are considered exposed to BBPs. My sense is that they are exposed to a variety of infection possibilities, but not necessarily BBPs. For example, I'm wondering if tetanus and hepatitis A vaccinations may be more important then Hep B immunization. I'm certain that training and PPE are in order, regardless of regulatory status - I just want to get the vaccinations right. Opinions, please? Thanks, Don ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 10:23:50 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Jeff Rubin Subject: Re: Blood-borne pathogens and plumbers? In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I'll pipe up on this one... My wife is an Infection Control Officer; I may ask her to elaborate in a future posting. Here are a couple of points I think I'm safe with: 1) BBPs are only part of an infection control program, so your concern is justified 2) CDC recommends EVERYONE receive the Hep B immunization; highly effective, negligible risk 3) Your concern about Hep A is appropriate (sorry, not sure about the rest), and the Hep A series is also highly effective and low-risk. We started giving all our water-rescue people the Hep A series as soon as it was available; it's now a prereq for activity (beats all those immune-globulin shots). I strongly recommend Hep B for everyone in my College, Hep A for those doing field work in water or anywhere in or south of the Rio Grande valley, and the new LYMErix vaccine for anyone in moderate-to-high-risk areas for Lyme Disease. 4) CDC also recommends that EVERYONE maintain tetanus immunity, which requires a booster every year. Your employees should've received it as kids as part of the DTP (diphtheria-tetanus-pertussis) series, and it's given routinely in minor emergency centers and ERs unless the patient knows s/he is current. I know that public universities can receive discounted vaccines from CDC; don't know about private ones. Congratulations on considering an aspect of safety that escapes many. Best of luck. Onward, JNR >Greetings, especially to those whose health and safety responsibilities go >beyond the laboratory: > >We are considering inclusion of our plumbers in our Blood-borne pathogen >exposure control plan, based on their potential exposure to raw sewage when >working with waste lines and sewer back-ups. > >I've seen conflicting statements in OSHA letters of interpretation and >other schools BBP plans as to whether plumbers are considered exposed to >BBPs. My sense is that they are exposed to a variety of infection >possibilities, but not necessarily BBPs. For example, I'm wondering if >tetanus and hepatitis A vaccinations may be more important then Hep B >immunization. > >I'm certain that training and PPE are in order, regardless of regulatory >status - I just want to get the vaccinations right. > >Opinions, please? > > Thanks, > Don Jeff Rubin, Asst. Dean for EHS College of Natural Sciences G2500 W.C. Hogg Building University of Texas at Austin Austin, TX 78712-1199 (512) 471-6176 (O) (512) 471-4998 (F) jrubin@mail.utexas.edu http://www.utexas.edu/cons/safety/ "The opinions of Dr. Rubin are not meant to offend anyone unless otherwise specified." ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 11:14:37 +0100 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Anne Skinner Subject: Re: Blood-borne pathogens and plumbers? In-Reply-To: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii I don't know what OSHA likes, but we vaccinate our plumbers. Anne Skinner /O\ /O\ /O\ /O\ /O\ /O\ /O\ /O\ /O\ /O\ /O\ /O\ /O\ /O\ Si Si Si Si Si Si Si Si Si Si Si Si Si Si Si \O/ \O/ \O/ \O/ \O/ \O/ \O/ \O/ \O/ \O/ \O/ \O/ \O/ \O/ Dr. Anne Skinner Chemistry Department, Williams College 47 Lab Campus Drive Williamstown, MA 01267 anne.r.skinner@williams.edu Phone: (413) 597-2285 Fax No: (413) 597-4116 /O\ /O\ /O\ /O\ /O\ /O\ /O\ /O\ /O\ /O\ /O\ /O\ /O\ /O\ Si Si Si Si Si Si Si Si Si Si Si Si Si Si Si \O/ \O/ \O/ \O/ \O/ \O/ \O/ \O/ \O/ \O/ \O/ \O/ \O/ \O/ ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 10:28:16 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Terri Crisp Subject: tetanus boosters Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" According to the CDC webpage, tetanus boosters are to be given every 10 years, not every year. Terri Crisp Environmental Safety Specialist University of Oklahoma 905 Asp Ave Room 112 Norman, OK 73071 email: tecrisp@ou.edu ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 09:17:21 -0600 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Sharyn Bake Subject: Re: Blood-borne pathogens and plumbers? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Here at UCSHC plumbers and some other maintenance personnel are definitely included in the BBP program and are offered the Hep B vacinations at no cost. Sharyn Baker Instructor Health and Safety Division University of Colorado Health Sciences Center Denver, Colorado 80262 Email: sharyn.baker@uchsc.edu Office phone: (303) 315-8003 > ---------- > From: Don Abramowitz > Reply To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List > Sent: Tuesday, April 27, 1999 9:52 AM > To: LABSAFETY-L@SIU.EDU > Subject: Blood-borne pathogens and plumbers? > > Greetings, especially to those whose health and safety responsibilities go > beyond the laboratory: > > We are considering inclusion of our plumbers in our Blood-borne pathogen > exposure control plan, based on their potential exposure to raw sewage > when > working with waste lines and sewer back-ups. > > I've seen conflicting statements in OSHA letters of interpretation and > other schools BBP plans as to whether plumbers are considered exposed to > BBPs. My sense is that they are exposed to a variety of infection > possibilities, but not necessarily BBPs. For example, I'm wondering if > tetanus and hepatitis A vaccinations may be more important then Hep B > immunization. > > I'm certain that training and PPE are in order, regardless of regulatory > status - I just want to get the vaccinations right. > > Opinions, please? > > Thanks, > Don > ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 12:39:03 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Jeff Rubin Subject: Re: tetanus boosters In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.32.19990427102816.007a39e0@ou.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Glad someone's reading what I write! That's how it should've read - thanks. JNR >According to the CDC webpage, tetanus boosters are to be given every 10 >years, not every year. > >Terri Crisp >Environmental Safety Specialist >University of Oklahoma >905 Asp Ave Room 112 >Norman, OK 73071 > >email: tecrisp@ou.edu ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 14:31:13 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Mark Yanchisin Subject: Two Questions MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Greeting folks!! I have 2 questions and hope you can help. I have a staff member that is allergic to latex. She needs to wear splash goggles, by we can not find any that are latex free. Fisher Scientific and our other suppliers are stumped but are still researching it. Anyone have any brand, supplier, etc. for latex free goggles? Our Hazardous Materials group is going to institute a chemical recycling program for usable lab chemicals (and possibly glassware and equipment). It will be web based for our campus labs. Our thought is that anyone who has any usable surplus chemicals would enter it on the web site. If anyone wanted something, they could check the web site and find out who has something they wanted. It would be up to the lab staff to make the calls and then retrieve what they want. EH&S would provide support for the web site, make chemicals available from what is picked up as waste (but still usable) and for pick-up and delivery for extreme hardship cases or hazardous chemicals only. Otherwise, we would ask all researchers to follow our "Chemical Move Policy" to move the stuff. We've taken a look at UC San Diego's system. Anyone have another system such as this that is ongoing that we could look at? Thanks in advance for any replies!! Mark Yanchisin Coordinator for Clinical and Lab Safety Programs University of Florida Env. Health and Safety PO Box 112190 Gainesville, FL 32611-2190 352-846-2550 (T) 352-392-7386 (F) Mark@ehs.ufl.edu People who say the little things don't bother them has never slept in a room with a mosquito. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 14:04:21 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Jeff Rubin Subject: Latex-free stuff In-Reply-To: <435ACBA4E161D1118AC7006008A057A02B3D36@ehs-nts1.ehs.ufl.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >I have a staff member that is allergic to latex. She needs to wear splash >goggles, by we can not find any that are latex free. Fisher Scientific and >our other suppliers are stumped but are still researching it. Anyone have >any brand, supplier, etc. for latex free goggles? I should get my wife to join NACHO - two referrals in one day! She deals with latex issues on a regular basis (and wrote an article for LS&EM Newsletter last year); she recommends checking out medical supply vendors instead of lab-supply vendors. Most medical supply houses have an ample assortment of latex-free products. Unfortunately, most of her references are at a different computer, but here's one we both remember: MedTech International in Altamonte Springs, FL. Both of us have dealt with Melanie Huggins, Sales Director, for a variety of equipment and found her very helpful. The number I have is (407) 880-6904. I'll try to provide some additional info tomorrow. JNR Jeff Rubin, Asst. Dean for EHS College of Natural Sciences G2500 W.C. Hogg Building University of Texas at Austin Austin, TX 78712-1199 (512) 471-6176 (O) (512) 471-4998 (F) jrubin@mail.utexas.edu http://www.utexas.edu/cons/safety/ "The opinions of Dr. Rubin are not meant to offend anyone unless otherwise specified." ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 15:00:49 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Janeen LaPierre Subject: Re: Blood-borne pathogens and plumbers? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Hello Don and all. Here at UNE, we include out plumbers in the BBP program and offer them the Hep B vaccine. The fact of the mater is, they are exposed to lots of potential pathogens in the sewer arena. Tetanus should definitely be up to date and Hep A is a great idea. But as you pointed out, there are no regulations really addressing what would be great in an ideal world. If your institution would cover this, I would say go for it. It would be highly prudent. At the very least include them in the BBP program and get the training and education stuff in place for them. For what its worth, Janeen. :):):):):):):):):):):):) Janeen Lapierre, CHO College of Osteopathic Medicine University of New England 11 Hills Beach Road Biddeford, ME 04005 E-Mail: JLaPierre@MAILBOX.UNE.EDU Phone: (207) 283-0170 ext 2446 Opinions are mine and not those of UNE. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 12:25:52 -0700 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Gordon Miller Subject: Hydrofluoric Acid Concentrations and Perchloric Acid Quantities Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Can any NACHOs offer some guidance about a concentration of HF that is so low that it can be regarded as "safe"? Likewise, at what quantity (or annual use rate or any other measure) of perchloric acid (or perchlorates) in a lab or space does one need to start getting very, very serious about designed-in safety precautions? Gordon Miller CHO miller22@llnl.gov ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 14:57:04 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Jeff Rubin Subject: Re: Hydrofluoric Acid Concentrations and Perchloric Acid Quantities In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Even 6-7% HF solution sold over the counter as Al-cleaner can cause problems if used without proper precautions (e.g., gloves, ventilation). Although most lab-concentrations of perchloric are very nasty to biological tissue, I'll assume you're referring to perchloric acid hoods. We require specialty hoods for heated perchloric or any temperature perchloric at concentrations > 72%. As with many chemicals, I've found a lot of perchloric acid in labs that didn't need it, and I made it a "targeted" item for disposal. If no one can tell me what it's for, it's gone. JNR >Can any NACHOs offer some guidance about a concentration of HF that is so >low that it can be regarded as "safe"? > >Likewise, at what quantity (or annual use rate or any other measure) of >perchloric acid (or perchlorates) in a lab or space does one need to start >getting very, very serious about designed-in safety precautions? Jeff Rubin, Asst. Dean for EHS College of Natural Sciences G2500 W.C. Hogg Building University of Texas at Austin Austin, TX 78712-1199 (512) 471-6176 (O) (512) 471-4998 (F) jrubin@mail.utexas.edu http://www.utexas.edu/cons/safety/ "The opinions of Dr. Rubin are not meant to offend anyone unless otherwise specified." ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 16:22:08 -0400 Reply-To: hontzb3@SERVAL.UOFS.EDU Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Barbara Hontz Organization: University of Scranton Subject: Safety glasses/goggles Comments: To: NAOSMM@listserv.rice.edu MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit I am sorry if some of you are getting this several times as it has gone to three lists that often cross one another. Hello! My name is Barbara Hontz, and I am from the University of Scranton in Pennsylvania. After having a student get splashed in the eye with "cat juice" during a dissection, there have been questions about wether students should be wearing safety glasses/goggles in biology lab. This particular student was wearing contacts even though the students are told not to. I wanted to know the conventions at other institutions about this topic. Are students required to wear safety glasses/goggles during general biology labs? Any advice on the topic would be greatly appreciated! Barbara Hontz ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 08:25:00 +1200 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: John Downey Subject: Re: Hydrofluoric Acid Concentrations and Perchloric Acid Quantiti es MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain I'm not sure about your regulations, but in New Zealand, any concentration of HF in excess of 0.1% is regarded as hazardous. Not sure about HClO4. Regards John Downey Dangerous Goods Inspector Waitakere City Council Private Bag 93109 Henderson Waitakere City New Zealand > -----Original Message----- > From: Gordon Miller [SMTP:miller22@LLNL.GOV] > Sent: Wednesday, 28 April 1999 07:26 > To: LABSAFETY-L@SIU.EDU > Subject: Hydrofluoric Acid Concentrations and Perchloric Acid > Quantities > > Can any NACHOs offer some guidance about a concentration of HF that is so > low that it can be regarded as "safe"? > > Likewise, at what quantity (or annual use rate or any other measure) of > perchloric acid (or perchlorates) in a lab or space does one need to start > getting very, very serious about designed-in safety precautions? > > Gordon Miller > CHO > miller22@llnl.gov ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 13:49:07 -0700 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Debbie Decker Subject: Re: Two Questions In-Reply-To: <435ACBA4E161D1118AC7006008A057A02B3D36@ehs-nts1.ehs.ufl.ed u> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 02:31 PM 4/27/99 -0400, you wrote: >Greeting folks!! > >I have 2 questions and hope you can help. > >I have a staff member that is allergic to latex. She needs to wear splash >goggles, by we can not find any that are latex free. Fisher Scientific and >our other suppliers are stumped but are still researching it. Anyone have >any brand, supplier, etc. for latex free goggles? I thought that Uvex made a silicon goggle? Oberon and Sellstrom both make a vinyl goggle with polycarbonate lenses. I'd probably check direct with some of the manufacturers. >Our Hazardous Materials group is going to institute a chemical recycling >program for usable lab chemicals >We've taken a look at UC San Diego's system. Anyone have another system >such as this that is ongoing that we could look at? Check out our website at www.ehs.ucdavis.edu - click on Chemicals spot and look at the chemical exchange program (named "CHEEP" or something similar). It may be of interest. Hope this helps, Deb. Debbie M. Decker, Health and Safety Specialist Environmental Health and Safety University of California, Davis 1 Shields Ave. Davis, CA 95616 (530)754-7964 (530)752-1493 dmdecker@ucdavis.edu ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 13:58:44 -0700 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Debbie Decker Subject: Re: Hydrofluoric Acid Concentrations and Perchloric Acid Quantities In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 12:25 PM 4/27/99 -0700, you wrote: >Can any NACHOs offer some guidance about a concentration of HF that is so >low that it can be regarded as "safe"? I've heard that 3% has been used in products to clean windows and the like. BUT (and it's a big one) only in the context of talking about HF injury to custodians using the product, without benefit of a haz com program. >Likewise, at what quantity (or annual use rate or any other measure) of >perchloric acid (or perchlorates) in a lab or space does one need to start >getting very, very serious about designed-in safety precautions? If it's being heated in any quantity, I would venture that serious designed-in safety precautions are needed. Used at room temperature, normal precautions, as with any strongly corrosive/reactive material would be needed. Hope this helps, Deb. Debbie M. Decker, Health and Safety Specialist Environmental Health and Safety University of California, Davis 1 Shields Ave. Davis, CA 95616 (530)754-7964 (530)752-1493 dmdecker@ucdavis.edu ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 16:09:19 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Katie Crysup Subject: Re: Two Questions In-Reply-To: <435ACBA4E161D1118AC7006008A057A02B3D36@ehs-nts1.ehs.ufl.ed u> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Anyone have >any brand, supplier, etc. for latex free goggles? couldn't that student use a face shield instead of goggles? I know it is more protection than required but better than none at all. > >Our Hazardous Materials group is going to institute a chemical recycling >program for usable lab chemicals (and possibly glassware and equipment). It >will be web based for our campus labs. Otherwise, we would ask all researchers to follow our >"Chemical Move Policy" to move the stuff. > >We've taken a look at UC San Diego's system. Anyone have another system >such as this that is ongoing that we could look at? We have no such system in place but we do have a great deal of surplus chemicals and glassware. Can I get more info about UC San Diego and anyone else who might have this system in place on how to get started. >Mark Yanchisin Katie Crysup Chemistry Laboratory Coordinator Texas A&M University -- Corpus Christi 6300 Ocean Drive, CS 130 Corpus Christi, Tx 78412 361-994-5701 (O) 361-994-2742 (F) kcrysup@falcon.tamucc.edu **Area code change, 512 no longer valid after Sept 1999** ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 17:21:24 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "Thomas J. Shelley" Subject: Re: Hydrofluoric Acid Concentrations and Perchloric Acid Quantities In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="============_-1286874409==_ma============" --============_-1286874409==_ma============ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >Can any NACHOs offer some guidance about a concentration of HF that is so >low that it can be regarded as "safe"? Gordon--I don't think that there is a demonstrably "safe" lower level of HF exposure. The MSDS I have in front of me states that chronic esposures of 2.6-4.7 ppm to the vapor of hydrofluoric acid caused skin, eye and nasal passage damage similar to all other HF exposures, only over a longer period of time. It's the fluoride ion in an acidic environment. It retains its activity even at very low levels. The ability to remain active at low levels is common to the gaseous form of HF as well. The OSHA TWA is 3 ppm, so with a substance where there can be adverse health effects below the TWA, I would avoid all contact. I read once that extensive contact with 2% HF caused the death of a worker in a confined space (tank). >Likewise, at what quantity (or annual use rate or any other measure) of >perchloric acid (or perchlorates) in a lab or space does one need to start >getting very, very serious about designed-in safety precautions? With perchloric aicd it's not how much is used as how it is used that drives safety design issues. I would say that any use of hot perchloric acid would require special engineering controls (fume hood with washdown). Cold use of dilute perchoric acid solutions, as is conducted in some wet biochemistry protocols, is not a problem and may be done on the open bench. I would not like to see more concentrated HF or perchloric acid in storage in a lab than can be used in a reasonable length of time, like 6 months or a year. For most labs this amounts to a liter or less in storage at any one time. Both need good secondary containment, specific spill and/or first aid kits, Lab Standard style SOPs, etc. We have process-specific labs that store and use up to 40-50 liters of HF at any one time. These labs have all kinds of bells and whistles. I hope this is useful information. Tom Shelley ********************************************************* Tom Shelley, Chemical Hygiene Officer, Cornell University Department of Environmental Health and Safety, 125 Humphreys Service Building, Ithaca, NY 14853. (607) 255-4288 tjs1@cornell.edu ****************************DISCLAIMER******************** The comments and views expressed in this communication are strictly my own and are not to be construed to officially represent those of my peers, supervisors or Cornell University. --============_-1286874409==_ma============ Content-Type: text/enriched; charset="us-ascii" >Can any NACHOs offer some guidance about a concentration of HF that is so >low that it can be regarded as "safe"? Gordon--I don't think that there is a demonstrably "safe" lower level of HF exposure. The MSDS I have in front of me states that chronic esposures of 2.6-4.7 ppm to the vapor of hydrofluoric acid caused skin, eye and nasal passage damage similar to all other HF exposures, only over a longer period of time. It's the fluoride ion in an acidic environment. It retains its activity even at very low levels. The ability to remain active at low levels is common to the gaseous form of HF as well. The OSHA TWA is 3 ppm, so with a substance where there can be adverse health effects below the TWA, I would avoid all contact. I read once that extensive contact with 2% HF caused the death of a worker in a confined space (tank). >Likewise, at what quantity (or annual use rate or any other measure) of >perchloric acid (or perchlorates) in a lab or space does one need to start >getting very, very serious about designed-in safety precautions? With perchloric aicd it's not how much is used as how it is used that drives safety design issues. I would say that any use of hot perchloric acid would require special engineering controls (fume hood with washdown). Cold use of dilute perchoric acid solutions, as is conducted in some wet biochemistry protocols, is not a problem and may be done on the open bench. I would not like to see more concentrated HF or perchloric acid in storage in a lab than can be used in a reasonable length of time, like 6 months or a year. For most labs this amounts to a liter or less in storage at any one time. Both need good secondary containment, specific spill and/or first aid kits, Lab Standard style SOPs, etc. We have process-specific labs that store and use up to 40-50 liters of HF at any one time. These labs have all kinds of bells and whistles. I hope this is useful information. Tom Shelley ********************************************************* Tom Shelley, Chemical Hygiene Officer, Cornell University Department of Environmental Health and Safety, 125 Humphreys Service Building, Ithaca, NY 14853. (607) 255-4288 tjs1@cornell.edu ****************************DISCLAIMER******************** The comments and views expressed in this communication are strictly my own and are not to be construed to officially represent those of my peers, supervisors or Cornell University. --============_-1286874409==_ma============-- ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 17:45:47 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "Thomas J. Shelley" Subject: Re: Two Questions In-Reply-To: <435ACBA4E161D1118AC7006008A057A02B3D36@ehs-nts1.ehs.ufl.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >Our Hazardous Materials group is going to institute a chemical recycling >program for usable lab chemicals (and possibly glassware and equipment). Mark--We undertake a similar process. EH&S hires a technical staff person from the Chemistry Department and a retired former college safety office one day a week to go to labs and remove unwanted chemicals in usable condition. EH&S staff assist with the proper disposal of the remaining chemicals, which it is generally the lab staff's responsibility to undertake per the terms of the CHP. The Chemistry Dept. staff person operates a chemical recycling program for the campus, with the inventory accessable by the Web. Many of the chemicals collected get used in the undergraduate teaching labs. I have been told that the expense of undertaking this program pays for most of the chemicals used in the undergrad labs, which is a considerable expense. This is an easily administered program and it is very rewarding as the lab staff are very appreciative of the service. Good luck with your programs. Tom Shelley ********************************************************* Tom Shelley, Chemical Hygiene Officer, Cornell University Department of Environmental Health and Safety, 125 Humphreys Service Building, Ithaca, NY 14853. (607) 255-4288 tjs1@cornell.edu ****************************DISCLAIMER******************** The comments and views expressed in this communication are strictly my own and are not to be construed to officially represent those of my peers, supervisors or Cornell University. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 17:27:18 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Don Abramowitz Subject: Re: Blood-borne pathogens and plumbers In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Thanks to all who responded to my plumber question. The feedback was very helpful. You may be pleased to know that they will join the ranks of the BBP program, and I will defer to our Health Center on the Hepatitis A vaccine question. Don ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 15:26:29 -0700 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: James Kapin Subject: Re: Two Questions (UCSD CHemCycle program) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Can I get more info about UC San Diego and anyone >else who might have this system in place on how to get started. > The UCSD ChemCycle program redistributes usable, surplus chemicals to UCSD labs, free of charge. Our people have put a great deal of work into this program, it is an important part of our campus waste reduction program, and some labs have used it to save 1000s of $. See our web page for info, or contact me and I can refer you to the right people - Jim Jim Kapin UCSD Chemical Safety Officer Mail Code 0920 9500 Gilman Drive, La Jolla CA 92093 (619)534-2823 fax (619)534-7982 mailto:jkapin@ucsd.edu ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 21:35:30 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "Julie J. O'Brien" Subject: Re: Two Questions In-Reply-To: <3.0.1.16.19990427160437.3d476b88@falcon.tamucc.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII > Anyone have > >any brand, supplier, etc. for latex free goggles? > > couldn't that student use a face shield instead of goggles? I know it is > more protection than required but better than none at all. > A face shield is not approved for use with chemicals unless goggles are worn under it. You shouldn't have any trouble finding latex free goggles. I agree with someone else's suggestion that you call the manufacturer. Julie O'Brien These opinions are my own. afn35210@afn.org ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 15:23:17 +1200 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Tony Haggerty Subject: Re: Fire Extinguisher Training MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Dry Powder extinguishers are the most efficient of the commonly available extinguishers. They work because the powder dissociates and bonds with the ions formed in the combustion process stopping the chemical reaction. It doesn't have to blanket the fire in fact it is more effective if it doesn't and remains airborne. Halon (CFC) extinguishers work in the same way but they will only be around for a little while longer as the Vienna Convention takes effect. Foam extinguishers require a huge amount of technique and are not very effective on vertical surfaces e.g. a fire running off a bench as they rely entirely on a smothering and cooling effect. Tony Haggerty NZ Fire Service ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 07:21:34 -0700 Reply-To: Marc Neuffer Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Marc Neuffer Organization: SafetyInfo.Com Subject: OSHA Hit List Comments: To: Health Care Safety MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0046_01BE9147.BEC77200" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0046_01BE9147.BEC77200 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable OSHA has just released a list of 12,500 businesses that constitute their = list of high profile injury employers - for a complete list of companies = and more info go to http://www.safetyinfo.com - click on [Daily Safety = News] Hope you're not on the list Regards Marc Neuffer Safety Info.Com ------=_NextPart_000_0046_01BE9147.BEC77200 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
OSHA has just released a list of 12,500 businesses = that=20 constitute their list of high profile injury employers - for a complete = list of=20 companies and more info go to http://www.safetyinfo.com  - = click on=20 [Daily Safety News]
 
Hope you're not on the list
 
Regards
Marc Neuffer
Safety = Info.Com
------=_NextPart_000_0046_01BE9147.BEC77200-- ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 08:31:52 -0400 Reply-To: hontzb3@SERVAL.UOFS.EDU Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Barbara Hontz Organization: University of Scranton Subject: Safety glasses Comments: To: A Biosafety Discussion List , naosmm@listserv.rice.edu MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------D24D01EBEA8A14D02A095C87" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------D24D01EBEA8A14D02A095C87 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit One more question if you will indulge me. The overwhelming response has been YES! wear safety glasses (much to my expectation), and now a faculty member asked me if regular eyeglasses -without splash guards are sufficient. My first instinct is no, but as you all know, documentation is everything. Any other thoughts? Thank you for your time! Barbara Hontz --------------D24D01EBEA8A14D02A095C87 Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=us-ascii; name="vcard.vcf" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: Card for Barbara Hontz Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="vcard.vcf" begin: vcard fn: Barbara Hontz n: Hontz;Barbara org: University of Scranton email;internet: hontzb3@uofs.edu title: Lab Supervisor x-mozilla-cpt: ;0 x-mozilla-html: FALSE version: 2.1 end: vcard --------------D24D01EBEA8A14D02A095C87-- ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 10:00:14 -0400 Reply-To: "edmiston@bluffton.edu" Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Michael Edmiston Organization: Bluffton College Subject: Safety Glasses/Goggles MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit This is specifically in response to Barbara Hontz's question about safety glasses in biology labs, but it also discusses our overall policy for anyone who is interested. We do allow contact lenses in all lab situations when accompanied by the appropriate additional protection. In other words, we do not distinguish between contact wearers and non-contact wearers. We believe this is appropriate, and we came to this conclusion far sooner than ACS did, because the supporting data have been out there at least for twenty years. Eye protection is required in chemistry labs all the time. Eye protection is required in biology and physics labs sometimes. Sometimes the eye protection is approved safety glasses with side-shields. Sometimes the protection is splash-proof goggles. In both cases we provide the glasses/goggles, or we must approve what the students provide. They must bear an ANSI label and glasses must provide wide coverage... no "designer" glasses. Here are some biology/physics examples. Biology students must wear safety glasses when using sharp instruments such as scalpels. They must also wear safety glasses when working with any preserved specimens even if they are not using sharp instruments. The idea is both protection from the sharp objects and also preservatives. We believe small amounts of preservatives could "squirt" and we deem glasses as adequate protection against this... we do not require splash-proof goggles to guard against this. Also note that students have the tendency to rub their eyes even though they are wearing latex gloves contaminated with preserving fluids. We find they do this unconsciously. The safety glasses help eliminate this because when their fingers hit the glasses it "wakes them up" to the idea that they should not be putting their contaminated gloved fingers near their eyes. Physics students wear safety glasses when they are doing work with projectiles or other objects that might hit them in the eye. In a year long course involving about 28 lab experiments, they wear glasses for four of the labs. Physics students also wear safety glasses if they are using license-exempt sealed radioactive sources with alpha or beta radiation. The idea is to stop the beta and alpha radiation from entering the eye. Therefore, splash-proof is not needed. If they are handling radioactive solutions then they wear splash-proof goggles. All students wear safety glasses in the machine shop for all machining operations. We believe that by having variable eye-protection requirements in which the students must wear protection according to the work being done, we are providing an education to the students. Overkill is protection, but it might make the students view safety as "a ridiculous intrusion" rather than a conscious decision approached rationally. Michael D. Edmiston, Ph.D. Phone/voice-mail: 419-358-3270 Professor of Chemistry & Physics FAX: 419-358-3323 Chairman, Science Department E-Mail edmiston@bluffton.edu Bluffton College 280 West College Avenue Bluffton, OH 45817 ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 11:07:29 +0100 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Armen Casparian Subject: Chain of Command Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Hi NACHO'S, This may seem like a moot point, but I would like to know whether CHO's in academic institutions are generally appointed by or report to someone in the academic arm (like a dean or provost) or the business/finance arm (like the director of public safety/campus security, etc.) of the institution. I want to get a sense of what arrangement is actually being practiced. I'd also like to hear from anyone who has an opinion as to which arm the CHO should be under and advantages or disadvantages of either arrangement, particularly for small colleges with primarily teaching laboratories and little research activity. Thanks for your help. Armen Casparian Associate Professor Wentworth Institute of Technology ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 11:15:39 +0100 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Anne Skinner Subject: Re: Chain of Command In-Reply-To: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > Hi NACHO'S, > > This may seem like a moot point, but I would like to know > whether CHO's in academic institutions are generally appointed by or > report to someone in the academic arm (like a dean or provost) or > > the business/finance arm (like the director of public safety/campus > security, etc.) of the institution. I want to get a sense of what > arrangement is actually being practiced. > The two common arrangements seem to be reporting to someone in physical plant and reporting to the business/fanance VP. The latter is very much preferable if it can be done (usually only happens if the job is created de novo instead of being handed out to someone who is already doing something slightly similar). The fewer steps in the chain the better, of course, and in the case of small colleges, the need to oversee both academic and non-academic areas really requires that the reporting be outside physical plant. In your case I would assume that although research may not be heavy at WIT, you have a lot of academic labs and a lot of students involved in chemical-related activities, so reporting to the VP for Administration (as I do) is even more suitable. But whatever works... Anne Skinner /O\ /O\ /O\ /O\ /O\ /O\ /O\ /O\ /O\ /O\ /O\ /O\ /O\ /O\ Si Si Si Si Si Si Si Si Si Si Si Si Si Si Si \O/ \O/ \O/ \O/ \O/ \O/ \O/ \O/ \O/ \O/ \O/ \O/ \O/ \O/ Dr. Anne Skinner Chemistry Department, Williams College 47 Lab Campus Drive Williamstown, MA 01267 anne.r.skinner@williams.edu Phone: (413) 597-2285 Fax No: (413) 597-4116 /O\ /O\ /O\ /O\ /O\ /O\ /O\ /O\ /O\ /O\ /O\ /O\ /O\ /O\ Si Si Si Si Si Si Si Si Si Si Si Si Si Si Si \O/ \O/ \O/ \O/ \O/ \O/ \O/ \O/ \O/ \O/ \O/ \O/ \O/ \O/ ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 12:11:52 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Jeff Rubin Subject: Re: Chain of Command In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I'm an Asst. Dean for EHS, with direct responisbilities only for my College (Natural Sciences) in a large university. Although I do have some campus-wide responsibilities (many of them chosen by me), I report to the Dean of my College. Our EHS dept. for the whole university reports to an Assoc. VP of Business Affairs. Rather than recommending a specific org chart, I'd say the important features of the reporting chain are executive access and executive action - probably not news to anyone. JNR Jeff Rubin, Asst. Dean for EHS College of Natural Sciences G2500 W.C. Hogg Building University of Texas at Austin Austin, TX 78712-1199 (512) 471-6176 (O) (512) 471-4998 (F) jrubin@mail.utexas.edu http://www.utexas.edu/cons/safety/ "The opinions of Dr. Rubin are not meant to offend anyone unless otherwise specified." ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 14:05:40 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "Lucy M. Zotter" Subject: campus transport of chemicals Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" What are the laws if any governing the transportation of chemicals from one building to another on a campus? Do any DOT rules apply? ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 14:16:24 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Janeen LaPierre Subject: Re: Safety glasses/goggles Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Here at UNE, we have students were appropriate PPE for the lab in question. Sometimes that means goggles. We use the same standards for risk that would be associated with chemicals used in a chem lab as justification. Students by and large have goggles for chem lab anyway, so it is really no big deal. The problem we have found is with selling the merits to the biology profs. It takes a little more planning so students can be reminded in advance of labs requiring PPE. We have suggested that faculty write a safety section into the lab manual. Many new versions have safety notes written into the labs. For what its worth, Janeen. :):):):):):):):):):):):) Janeen Lapierre, CHO College of Osteopathic Medicine University of New England 11 Hills Beach Road Biddeford, ME 04005 E-Mail: JLaPierre@MAILBOX.UNE.EDU Phone: (207) 283-0170 ext 2446 Opinions are mine and not those of UNE. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 14:33:14 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Don Abramowitz Subject: Re: Fire Extinguisher Training In-Reply-To: <011101be9126$761f4c60$542810ac@HPC013.FIRE.ORG.NZ> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Halon (CFC) extinguishers work in the same way but >they will only be around for a little while longer as the Vienna Convention >takes effect. There are new "ozone-friendly" HCFC extinguishers, the trade name of which escapes me at present (but available on request), available to replace the halon portables. I imagine the same limitations on effectiveness and safety (more toxic byproducts upon exposure to fire) are in effect. Taht said, we are phasing in ABC dry chem portables as the choice for most appplications for portables (where they are not already in service). Those concerned about damage to electronic equipment generally accept the argument that the powder contamination is of little consequence if said equipment is burning. For equipment near the discharge of a dry chem extinguisher, suffering collateral dust damage, clean-up is generally possible (albeit tedious), as long as this adjacent equipment was not unduly heated. (Heat makes the powder stick irreparably to surfaces.) There again, if the equipment got that hot, the dust is likely irrelevant to the demise of the equipment. Don ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Donald Abramowitz, CIH Occupational and Environmental Safety Officer Bryn Mawr College | Swarthmore College 101 N. Merion Avenue | 500 College Avenue Bryn Mawr, PA 19010 | Swarthmore PA 19081 ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 14:45:05 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Janeen LaPierre Subject: Re: Chain of Command Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Here at UNE we have a little mix of everything. We have an Environmental Heath and Safety Officer who reports to the director of facilities management who reports to the risk manager for the university. One would think that the CHO's would report to the EHSO but we do not. We are appointed by the Dean of the college we work for. I have a full time job as a lab coordinator and research assistant in the med. school. My counter part in the undergraduate school is the chem lab coordinator and instructor. While at times this can be a bit confusing when you need to get something done quickly, by and large it works out well. We as CHO's have the attention of the academic side of things and with a little communication our EHSO has the attention of the business side of things. If I could change one thing, I would have the EHSO report directly to the Risk Manager who is also our VP of finance or better yet would be the President. Someone needs to be placed as high in the pecking order as possible to keep safety issues and funding in the fore front. For what its worth, Janeen. :):):):):):):):):):):):) Janeen Lapierre, CHO College of Osteopathic Medicine University of New England 11 Hills Beach Road Biddeford, ME 04005 E-Mail: JLaPierre@MAILBOX.UNE.EDU Phone: (207) 283-0170 ext 2446 Opinions are mine and not those of UNE. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 13:58:51 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Katie Crysup Subject: Re: Safety glasses/goggles In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 02:16 PM 4/28/99 -0400, you wrote: On wearing goggles in biology labs. The problem we have found is with selling the merits to the biology profs. It takes a little more planning so students can be reminded in advance of labs requiring PPE. We have suggested that faculty write a safety section into the lab manual. Many new versions have safety notes written into the labs. > >For what its worth, Janeen. I have the same problem with also convincing the envirommental clases and the biology lab coordinator. They provide safety glasses (no side sheilds) but the students never wear them. They have the option to or not. It is not required. Katie Crysup Chemistry Laboratory Coordinator Texas A&M University -- Corpus Christi 6300 Ocean Drive, CS 130 Corpus Christi, Tx 78412 361-994-5701 (O) 361-994-2742 (F) kcrysup@falcon.tamucc.edu **Area code change, 512 no longer valid after Sept 1999** ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 15:02:11 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Don Abramowitz Subject: Re: campus transport of chemicals In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19990428140540.007c1100@email.allencol.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >What are the laws if any governing the transportation of chemicals from one >building to another on a campus? Do any DOT rules apply? My understanding is that you are outside of DOT for transport between buildings IF you stay off public streets. On a big campus, where transport on public roads is involved, I believe DOT applies. On a slight tangent, EPA used to insist on separate EPA ID nos. for wastes generated on different parts of a campus divided by a public road, but I believe they've softened on this. I don't think this carries over to DOT. Don ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 15:28:19 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Don Abramowitz Subject: Re: Safety glasses Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" and now a faculty member asked me if regular eyeglasses >-without splash guards are sufficient. My first instinct is no, but as >you all know, documentation is everything. >Any other thoughts? Go with your instinct. Regular glasses don't count. There is an impact standard per CSPS (Consumer product safety commission) for regular glasses, but it is less stringent than ANSI's for safety glasses. (I've heard lots of folks cite this as proof that their regular glasses are shatterproof.) Also, ANSI sets a minimum lens thickness (thickerr than street glasses), and such things as strength of the lens mounting in the frame and the strength of hinges. Sideshields have to be permanently mounted now for ANSI, and no sideshields at all leaves a big gap in protection, literally. Don ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Donald Abramowitz, CIH Occupational and Environmental Safety Officer Bryn Mawr College | Swarthmore College 101 N. Merion Avenue | 500 College Avenue Bryn Mawr, PA 19010 | Swarthmore PA 19081 ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 15:00:35 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Jeff Rubin Subject: Re: campus transport of chemicals In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" They haven't softened much, at least not in Region VI. JNR >On a slight tangent, EPA used to insist on separate EPA ID nos. for wastes >generated on different parts of a campus divided by a public road, but I >believe they've softened on this. I don't think this carries over to DOT. Jeff Rubin, Asst. Dean for EHS College of Natural Sciences G2500 W.C. Hogg Building University of Texas at Austin Austin, TX 78712-1199 (512) 471-6176 (O) (512) 471-4998 (F) jrubin@mail.utexas.edu http://www.utexas.edu/cons/safety/ "The opinions of Dr. Rubin are not meant to offend anyone unless otherwise specified." ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 15:11:33 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Bill Schultz Subject: Re[2]: campus transport of chemicals MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I recommend you call DOT on this one. The general information number is 800-467-4922. DOT regulations only apply to materials oferred up in commerce. DOT regulations do not apply to the transportation of hazardous materials in a private or rented vehicle operated by government personnel, in the course of their work duties, soley for non-commercial purposes. Many knowledgable people told me this was not true so I obtained it in writing from the DOT, Regulations Development, Office of Hazardous Materials Standards. DOT would have to determine if a similar exemption exists for your situation. Bill Schultz ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re: campus transport of chemicals Author: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List at Internet-Mail Date: 4/28/99 3:02 PM >What are the laws if any governing the transportation of chemicals from one >building to another on a campus? Do any DOT rules apply? My understanding is that you are outside of DOT for transport between buildings IF you stay off public streets. On a big campus, where transport on public roads is involved, I believe DOT applies. On a slight tangent, EPA used to insist on separate EPA ID nos. for wastes generated on different parts of a campus divided by a public road, but I believe they've softened on this. I don't think this carries over to DOT. Don ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 13:56:14 -0700 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Gordon Miller Subject: When Goggles, Faceshields, Spectacles Are Used Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" We have a controversy going here that tacks on to the safety spectacle discussion now in progress. We're trying to develop a policy about when one should use the following for splash protection: Safety spectacles - I don't think safety spectacles, even with industrial grade lenses, alone are good for anything stronger or more toxic than lemonade. Safety spectacles with sideshields Safety spectacles with sideshields worn under a face shield - this beats portless goggles because the combination doesn't fog up as quickly Chemical goggles (with ports) Michael Edmiston's reply in which eye protection is associated with scenarios sounds like a good way to address the issue. Another, possibly complementary, way would be to specify more capable protection for bases, HF, heated solutions, and other more highly eye hazardous exposure situations. This would be done after stating that eye protection is based on the probability of a splash mishap and the severity of the outcome. So in a scenario where faceshield over specs/sideshields would be OK for room temperature mineral acids, goggles would be called for in the case of caustics or boiling corrosives. I'd appreciate hearing how others deal with the issue. One final question - years ago I hear glacial acetic acid was really eye hazardous because it is fat soluble, gets into fatty tissue around the eye where eyewashes can't get to it, and leaches out slowly to cause injury. Has anyone else heard this? Can this be confirmed? Denied? Gordon Miller, CIH CHO miller22@llnl.gov ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 15:09:50 -0700 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "John M. Neil" Subject: Re: Re[2]: campus transport of chemicals In-Reply-To: <9904289253.AA925330470@ftdetrck-ccmail.army.mil> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" When I worked for Uncle Sam, I got a reading from the solicator's office that DOT reg's didn't apply if it was a government employee, using a government vehicle between government facilities. "in commerce" kicked in if was a contract employee, a non-government vehicle (rental), or if you went to a commerical facility such as a freight depot. I also know the Army said one had to comply with DOT reg's on post if the vehicle crossed a public road. I suppect the rules are different for a private school and for a public one. At 03:11 PM 4/28/99 -0500, you wrote: > I recommend you call DOT on this one. The general information number is > 800-467-4922. > > DOT regulations only apply to materials oferred up in commerce. DOT > regulations do not apply to the transportation of hazardous materials in a > private or rented vehicle operated by government personnel, in the course of > their work duties, soley for non-commercial purposes. Many knowledgable people > told me this was not true so I obtained it in writing from the DOT, Regulations > Development, Office of Hazardous Materials Standards. > > DOT would have to determine if a similar exemption exists for your situation. > > Bill Schultz > > > >______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ >Subject: Re: campus transport of chemicals >Author: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List at Internet-Mail >Date: 4/28/99 3:02 PM > > >>What are the laws if any governing the transportation of chemicals from one >>building to another on a campus? Do any DOT rules apply? > >My understanding is that you are outside of DOT for transport between >buildings IF you stay off public streets. On a big campus, where transport >on public roads is involved, I believe DOT applies. > >On a slight tangent, EPA used to insist on separate EPA ID nos. for wastes >generated on different parts of a campus divided by a public road, but I >believe they've softened on this. I don't think this carries over to DOT. > Don > > John M. Neil Thermochemistry Facility Department of Chemical Engineering & Material Science University of California at Davis One Shields Avenue Davis, CA 95616-8779 phone: (530) 754-2130 Fax: (530) 752-9307 "Entropy isn't what it use to be." ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 17:41:27 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "Dr. Linda A. Swihart" Subject: Re: campus transport of chemicals In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Somebody write a clear and concise explanation please that explains exactly how and where the concept of "interstate commerce" enters into this whole business of DOT regs possibly applying to transport of chemicals and/or waste (via public roads by univeristy emplyees in university vehicles or personal vehicles) from one campus building to another. After they've been bought and paid for. Maybe they're intended for research in another building, or maybe they're waste going to the waste building, but I don't see how they are involved in interstate commerce at these points. Linda >They haven't softened much, at least not in Region VI. >>On a slight tangent, EPA used to insist on separate EPA ID nos. for wastes >>generated on different parts of a campus divided by a public road, but I >>believe they've softened on this. I don't think this carries over to DOT. > > ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 16:31:02 -0700 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Michael Ahler Subject: campus transport of chemicals In-Reply-To: <9904289253.AA925330470@ftdetrck-ccmail.army.mil> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; name="campus" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Dear NACHO's A similar question came to me from a chemistry Faculty member here a couple of years ago. The question concerned the transport of chemicals in a professor's car to a local middle school to do a "Magic Show". I discovered the following information via telephone: [I shall cut and paste my original response here] "NOTES ON TRANSPORTATION OF CHEMICALS BY PRIVATE VEHICLE I have verbal information from DOT and CHP ( California Highway Patrol) that says the transportation of chemicals on public roads for the purpose of performing demonstrations at a remote site (such as a grammar school) is "unregulated" (the exact term given to me) within certain guidelines. Read on: DOT (Federal Department of Transportation): As long as the transport of your material is "not for commerce" -their term- (you are not trying to sell or carry the chemicals for profit ), this activity is unregulated by DOT. There are no weight limits. This I was told yesterday, June 9, 1997, by Jody George at DOT. I called the DOT toll free number at (800) 467-4922. CHP (California Highway Patrol- This would concern CA Vehicle Code requirements) You may transport chemicals in your car as long as: - there are no explosives in the load - there is no "waste material" (no hazardous waste) in the load, and - the load does not exceed 1,000 pounds. This I was told today by Officer Doug Villers, of the CHP. His telephone number is (805) 549-3261 (San Luis Obispo Office). My recommendation is that at your destination there be working emergency equipment similar to that found in a chemistry lab here ( in building 52). This would include eyewash, shower, fire extinguisher, and spill cleanup material. The nature of the spill cleanup material would be determined by the nature of the chemicals you are carrying. I would also recommend you carry everything in an "overpack" -- a 5-gallon bucket with a secure lid -- containing a few bottles of material and enough vermiculite to fill the bucket to ca. 90% capacity. The packed bucket should be able to withstand being kicked across the room a couple of times (were you to be moved to such behavior) and not leak or break anything. This would be evidence that the overpack can withstand the mechanical shock of a sudden stop or impact on the road. If your assortment of chemicals consists of things which would react with each other in an undesirable way (incompatible chemicals) you should use as many separate "overpack" buckets as is necessary to prevent such mixtures from occurring in the case of a leaking or broken container(s). Let me know if you have any questions about all of this." [end paste] I realize this is a bit different than the original question on "Across Campus" transport, but the responses were beginning to touch here also. When the hazardous material being transported is WASTE, then ( in California) the Department of Toxic Substances Control ( DTSC) also gets involved. Transporters of hazardous waste are required to be Permitted by DTSC for this activity. If your campus has several physical locations connected by public roadways, your campus, the vehicle, and the driver must posess various types of Permits to Transport Hazardous Waste in order to legally transport hazardous waste from one part of the campus to another. DOT packaging, labeling, placarding, and MANIFESTING requirements must be observed This qualifies as travel along a public roadway ( off campus travel) even if the distance is less than 400 yards. There is no numerical distance threshold for this that I know of. However, if your campus is bisected by a public roadway you can, in California, legally drive ACROSS that road ( not ALONG the road) to transport wastes from the east campus to the west campus without the DTSC and DOT permits and restrictions. I recommend that whenever you transport chemicals ( especially in glass, waste or not), in or on any type of wheeled vehicle and over rough surfaces ( asphalt between buildings) that you package the bottles very similarly to DOT standards. I have a couple of medium and large resiliant containers ( Rubbermaid "Action Packers") with latchable lids. For removing glass containers of chemicals ( usually waste) from a campus building to take to another ( usually my Haz Mat building) I make a quasi Lab Pack with the Action Packers and vermiculite. Travel by hand truck or by pickup truck is very stress free this way. In the days of yore I have had the pleasure of broken glass bottles caused by the rough surface my loaded lab cart was passing over at the time. A cleanup like that can take a big chunk out of your day. ......Almost more than I deserve to expect you to read. Thanks for listening. Michael Ahler, CHO mahler@calpoly.edu Risk Management Cal Poly San Luis Obispo, California ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 21:02:28 EDT Reply-To: Labsafe@aol.com Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Labsafe@AOL.COM Subject: Re: Two Questions MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 99-04-27 17:08:09 EDT, you write: << couldn't that student use a face shield instead of goggles? I know it is more protection than required but better than none at all. >> It is not more protection with respect to the eyes. The ANSI standard makes it clear that a face shield is not a substitute for chemical splash goggles. ... Jim ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 08:10:31 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Bob Burns Subject: Re: When Goggles, Faceshields, Spectacles Are Used MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I have a pair of safety glasses on my desk which saved the sight of a lab worker- she was distilling a flammable solvent and the flask broke, causing a flash fire. She had her hair burnt in the front and 1st degree burns on the face, but no injury to the eyes. I disagree that glasses are not "good for anything stronger or more toxic than lemonade." IMHO, safety glasses with side shields are effective and are also worn in our labs. I've never seen an industrial lab with goggle rules where they were actually worn. This is an industrial lab situation where people work in lab for 8 plus hours every day. ----- Original Message ----- From: Gordon Miller To: Sent: Wednesday, April 28, 1999 16:56 Subject: When Goggles, Faceshields, Spectacles Are Used > We have a controversy going here that tacks on to the safety spectacle > discussion now in progress. > > We're trying to develop a policy about when one should use the following > for splash protection: > > Safety spectacles - I don't think safety spectacles, even with industrial > grade lenses, alone are good for anything stronger or more toxic than > lemonade. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 08:13:11 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Naomi Kelly Subject: Re: Safety glasses In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Side shields have to be permanently mounted according to ANSI? At 03:28 PM 4/28/99 -0500, you wrote: >and now a faculty member asked me if regular eyeglasses >>-without splash guards are sufficient. My first instinct is no, but as >>you all know, documentation is everything. >>Any other thoughts? > >Go with your instinct. Regular glasses don't count. There is an impact >standard per CSPS (Consumer product safety commission) for regular glasses, >but it is less stringent than ANSI's for safety glasses. (I've heard lots >of folks cite this as proof that their regular glasses are shatterproof.) >Also, ANSI sets a minimum lens thickness (thickerr than street glasses), >and such things as strength of the lens mounting in the frame and the >strength of hinges. > >Sideshields have to be permanently mounted now for ANSI, and no sideshields >at all leaves a big gap in protection, literally. > > Don > >~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Donald Abramowitz, CIH > Occupational and Environmental Safety Officer > > Bryn Mawr College | Swarthmore College > 101 N. Merion Avenue | 500 College Avenue > Bryn Mawr, PA 19010 | Swarthmore PA 19081 ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 08:54:57 -0600 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "Helen B. Gerhard" Subject: Re: Safety glasses MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain What about prescription safety glasses with removable side shields? Thanks! Helen >Sideshields have to be permanently mounted now for ANSI, and no sideshields >at all leaves a big gap in protection, literally. > > Don > ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 08:14:24 -0700 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "John M. Neil" Subject: Re: campus transport of chemicals In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19990428174127.008c0500@postoffice.purdue.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" For the federal government to regulate commerce, it has to concern interstate commerce which is traced back to the constitution (look in the intial section of the regulation). It was put into the constitution to prevent states from putting barriers to hinder trade between states. Like many other things in the constitution, defining interstate commerce for a regulation can become a common sense defying exercise in logic. Often the stretch is made to make it as inclusive as possible. With the transport of hazardous materials, it really helps to having everyone playing by the same set of rules. At an accident scene emergency responders shouldn't have to stop and figure out which set of rules apply to a particular vehicle. My experience has been if people can make the trip from one building to another without following the rules, it soon becomes a trip from one facilty to another without following the rules. This soon becomes the rules never apply to me. (I use to work of a federal agency that did lots of field work). JN in deffing At 05:41 PM 4/28/99 -0500, you wrote: >Somebody write a clear and concise explanation please that explains exactly >how and where the concept of "interstate commerce" enters into this whole >business of DOT regs possibly applying to transport of chemicals and/or >waste (via public roads by univeristy emplyees in university vehicles or >personal vehicles) from one campus building to another. After they've been >bought and paid for. Maybe they're intended for research in another >building, or maybe they're waste going to the waste building, but I don't >see how they are involved in interstate commerce at these points. > >Linda > > >>They haven't softened much, at least not in Region VI. > >>>On a slight tangent, EPA used to insist on separate EPA ID nos. for wastes >>>generated on different parts of a campus divided by a public road, but I >>>believe they've softened on this. I don't think this carries over to DOT. >> >> > > ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 11:19:06 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Bob Burns Subject: Re: Safety glasses MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The last pair I got have SS permanently attached. We can't get them any other way, and we can't find the removable SS anywhere. ----- Original Message ----- From: Helen B. Gerhard To: Sent: Thursday, April 29, 1999 10:54 Subject: Re: Safety glasses > What about prescription safety glasses with removable side shields? > > Thanks! > > Helen > > >Sideshields have to be permanently mounted now for ANSI, and no > sideshields > >at all leaves a big gap in protection, literally. > > > > Don > > > > > ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 11:38:06 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Sharon Reed Subject: Re: Safety glasses Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii We get removable sideshields by the bagful (a dollar each), so I can hand them out to employees whenever they break or lose theirs. Now, if I need to require permanently attached SSs, I'b better find out so I can change my policy! I get them, by the way, from our local "Empire Vision" store, a central New York business. So, can someone give me a definitive answer on the requirement for permanently attached sideshields? Bob Burns on 04/29/99 11:19:06 AM Please respond to LABSAFETY-L Discussion List To: LABSAFETY-L@SIU.EDU cc: (bcc: Sharon Reed/PEDNY/Pall/US) Subject: Re: Safety glasses The last pair I got have SS permanently attached. We can't get them any other way, and we can't find the removable SS anywhere. ----- Original Message ----- From: Helen B. Gerhard To: Sent: Thursday, April 29, 1999 10:54 Subject: Re: Safety glasses > What about prescription safety glasses with removable side shields? > > Thanks! > > Helen > > >Sideshields have to be permanently mounted now for ANSI, and no > sideshields > >at all leaves a big gap in protection, literally. > > > > Don > > > > > ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 11:08:10 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Patricia DePra Subject: Re: When Goggles, Faceshields, Spectacles Are Used I've learned quite a bit from this listserv -- thanks to everyone for contributing. On my list for the summer is to try out various safety goggles that have been recommended, so that our bookstore can carry more than one brand for the students to choose from. One of my students 'test drove' a pair that retails for $ 1.65. She said that they were wonderful -- really comfortable, didn't fog, etc. Then I noticed that I could stick my finger in-between the bridge of the goggles and her nose, and poke her in the eye. These are Z87 splash goggles, but obviously are not for her. The other goggles had a triangular piece of plastic that fit at the top of the space for the bridge, that protected the eyes further. One would have to have a pretty big nose for these goggles to work. So, I suppose that my point is that it seems as though protection is more important than whether or not the goggles are approved by whomever. (As long as the minimum regulations are indeed followed.) The brand is Masterman's. Does anyone know of a good brand for someone like me who has a very low bridge? Thanks for the great dialogue, Patricia DePra Westfield State College Westfield Mass ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 10:04:08 -0700 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Nadine Grady Subject: Re: campus transport of chemicals MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" John Neil wrote: > For the federal government to regulate commerce, it has to concern > interstate commerce which is traced back to the constitution > (look in the intial section of the regulation). It was put into the > constitution to prevent states from putting barriers to hinder trade between > states. As of 10/1 98, DOT's Hazardous Materials Rules apply in INTRAstate commerce as well. If you have Adobe Acrobat, you can view DOT's brochure about it at http://hazmat.dot.gov/gen42c.pdf . At http://hazmat.dot.gov/rulemake.htm#final you can find summaries of the final rule, two notices of technical amendments and a public meeting notice (search the page for HM-200). You can also link to the text from there. Here's the summary (cut and pasted) fron the final rule notice: SUMMARY: This final rule requires that all intrastate shippers and carriers comply with the Hazardous Materials Regulations (HMR) with certain exceptions. This action is necessary to comply with amendments to the Federal hazardous materials transportation law mandating that DOT regulate the transportation of hazardous materials in intrastate commerce. The intended effect of this rule is to raise the level of safety in the transportation of hazardous materials by applying a uniform system of safety regulations to all hazardous materials transported in commerce throughout the United States. Apparently Congress amended the DOT's previous limitation to interstate commerce only ************************************************************** Nadine B. Grady, MS, CIH Chemical Hygiene Officer Whitworth College 300 W. Hawthorne Rd. Spokane, WA 99251-3903 (509) 777-4510 ngrady@whitworth.edu ******************************************************************* "There are old researchers and there are bold researchers, but there are no old, bold researchers!" -- Anon. ******************************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 13:46:09 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Don Abramowitz Subject: Re: Safety glasses Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >What about prescription safety glasses with removable side shields? As I understand it, they're not acceptable for the latest ANSI purposes. On the other hand, if the removable side shields are actually worn when needed, I'd quit while I was ahead - I've never seen an ANSI policeman coming around to check on this sort of thing, and I don't see a hazard here, if the sideshields clip on solidly. (Goggles vs. safety glasses questions aside.) I'd also venture to guess that a dab of Crazy Glue violates the whole approval, for fear of chemical degradation compromising the integrity of the entire assembly, or some such thing. Don ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Donald Abramowitz, CIH Occupational and Environmental Safety Officer Bryn Mawr College | Swarthmore College 101 N. Merion Avenue | 500 College Avenue Bryn Mawr, PA 19010 | Swarthmore PA 19081 ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 13:46:09 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Don Abramowitz Subject: Re: campus transport of chemicals Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >>Somebody write a clear and concise explanation please that explains exactly >>how and where the concept of "interstate commerce" enters into this whole >>business of DOT regs I think Michael's answer regarding "not for commerce" cinches the DOT issue. "Interstate Commerce" is indeed a separate concept, as John said, necessary for the federal govt. to establish its jurisdiction in regulating business. In my OSHA days, every inspection report required a phrase to document the existence of interstate commerce taking place at a site under inspection. This was so easy to do that it seemed like a pointless exercise - typically cite the presence of a particular tool, vehicle, or machine manufactured out of state, or the existence of a telephone used to make or receive interstate calls. I never heard of an inspection negated by the absence of interstate commerce. Don ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 13:47:45 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Bob Burns Subject: Re: campus transport of chemicals MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit A query, a little off thread: Can one carry, legally, non-hazardous materials in one's car? How about airplanes? ----- Original Message ----- From: Nadine Grady To: Sent: Thursday, April 29, 1999 13:04 Subject: Re: campus transport of chemicals > John Neil wrote: > > For the federal government to regulate commerce, it has to concern > > interstate commerce which is traced back to the constitution > > (look in the intial section of the regulation). It was put into the > > constitution to prevent states from putting barriers to hinder trade > between > > states. > > As of 10/1 98, DOT's Hazardous Materials Rules apply in INTRAstate commerce > as well. > If you have Adobe Acrobat, you can view DOT's brochure about it at > http://hazmat.dot.gov/gen42c.pdf . At > http://hazmat.dot.gov/rulemake.htm#final you can find summaries of the final > rule, two notices of technical amendments and a public meeting notice > (search the page for HM-200). You can also link to the text from there. > Here's the summary (cut and pasted) fron the final rule notice: > > SUMMARY: This final rule requires that all intrastate shippers and carriers > comply with the Hazardous Materials Regulations (HMR) with certain > exceptions. This action is necessary to comply with amendments to the > Federal hazardous materials transportation law mandating that DOT regulate > the transportation of hazardous materials in intrastate commerce. The > intended effect of this rule is to raise the level of safety in the > transportation of hazardous materials by applying a uniform system of safety > regulations to all hazardous materials transported in commerce throughout > the United States. > > Apparently Congress amended the DOT's previous limitation to interstate > commerce only > > ************************************************************** > Nadine B. Grady, MS, CIH > Chemical Hygiene Officer > Whitworth College > 300 W. Hawthorne Rd. > Spokane, WA 99251-3903 > (509) 777-4510 > ngrady@whitworth.edu > ******************************************************************* > "There are old researchers and there are bold researchers, > but there are no old, bold researchers!" -- Anon. > ******************************************************************* > > ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 13:54:05 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Janeen LaPierre Subject: Re: When Goggles, Faceshields, Spectacles Are Used Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Call Lab Safety and Supply and ask for the tech line. You can request a pair of several different brands of goggle to test drive to help you in the decision making process. They will send you a trial pair free of charge. UVEX Stealth Goggles come in two different frame sizes to accommodate smaller faces. I personally like these and this is the brand we stock in our book store for students. There is also a less expensive model for them to choose from. Good luck in your search. I have to agree that fit is as important as compliance with ANSI. It doesn't matter if the goggle or safety glass is ANSI approved if it does not fit the face of the eyes it is protecting. For what its worth, Janeen. :):):):):):):):):):):):) Janeen Lapierre, CHO College of Osteopathic Medicine University of New England 11 Hills Beach Road Biddeford, ME 04005 E-Mail: JLaPierre@MAILBOX.UNE.EDU Phone: (207) 283-0170 ext 2446 Opinions are mine and not those of UNE. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 14:02:34 -0400 Reply-To: fullert@bc.edu Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Thomas Fuller Subject: Re: When Goggles, Faceshields, Spectacles Are Used In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII I am really enjoying this discussion on appropriate protective eyewear in laboratories. I went to a training session a few years ago on how to communicate with generation X'ers and the speaker pointed out that, unlike 'baby boomers' who can get by on vauge and general information and guidelines to make safety decisions, generation X'ers usually need more concise directions. We often overlook this in the development of our safety programs and training. The current revision of our Chemical Hygiene Plan states that "appropriate eyewear should be worn" for various lab activities. I think it will be a great improvement to identify, in detail, the specifics of which activities and chemicals require which types of eyewear. I am considering developing a questionaire to be sent to Principle Investigators for them to participate and provide input to this process of appropriate eyewear selection. If anyone has any suggestions they would be very helpful to me as I develop this list. On Wed, 28 Apr 1999 13:56:14 -0700 Gordon Miller wrote: > We have a controversy going here that tacks on to the safety spectacle > discussion now in progress. > > We're trying to develop a policy about when one should use the following > for splash protection: > > Safety spectacles - I don't think safety spectacles, even with industrial > grade lenses, alone are good for anything stronger or more toxic than > lemonade. > > Safety spectacles with sideshields > > Safety spectacles with sideshields worn under a face shield - this beats > portless goggles because the combination doesn't fog up as quickly > > Chemical goggles (with ports) > > Michael Edmiston's reply in which eye protection is associated with > scenarios sounds like a good way to address the issue. > > Another, possibly complementary, way would be to specify more capable > protection for bases, HF, heated solutions, and other more highly eye > hazardous exposure situations. This would be done after stating that eye > protection is based on the probability of a splash mishap and the severity > of the outcome. So in a scenario where faceshield over specs/sideshields > would be OK for room temperature mineral acids, goggles would be called for > in the case of caustics or boiling corrosives. > > I'd appreciate hearing how others deal with the issue. > > One final question - years ago I hear glacial acetic acid was really eye > hazardous because it is fat soluble, gets into fatty tissue around the eye > where eyewashes can't get to it, and leaches out slowly to cause injury. > Has anyone else heard this? Can this be confirmed? Denied? > > Gordon Miller, CIH > CHO > miller22@llnl.gov ---------------------- Thomas Fuller fullert@bc.edu Boston College ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 13:11:43 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "Dr. Linda A. Swihart" Subject: Automobile transport of chemicals In-Reply-To: <002a01be9268$63d4d820$5b002c0a@bburns> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 01:47 PM 4/29/99 -0400, you wrote: >A query, a little off thread: > >Can one carry, legally, non-hazardous materials in one's car? > >How about airplanes? I'm going to suppose that the "non-" part was a slip. Is there some possibility that transporting hazardous materials such as insect repellant, gasoline, Bo-Peep ammonia, and the gallon of MEK I picked up at the hardware store yesterday is illegal? And while we're at it, the bagger at the grocery but the Bo-Peep and the Chlorox in the same bag. Did he do something illegal? When I flew to New Orleans last summer I took a 2 oz container of 95% N,N-diethyl-m-toluamide (triple-bagged in ziploc-type baggies) in my luggage. Was that probably OK? ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 14:16:43 EST Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Karla Bowers Subject: glove selection Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Friends, Two questions; one general, one specific: The general one: Is (are) there a good resource(s) for choosing a glove material for a specific chemical? I've looked at the selection charts in catalogs but they are very short. I have some general guidelines but I would like something more specific. The specific one: What is the glove of choice for 2,4-dinitrophenylhydrazine? Is there a resource that lists this chemical specifically or must I generalize based on its hazards? Thank you, Karla Bowers Carson-Newman College bowers@cncacc.cn.edu ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 14:51:28 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "Davis, Scott" Subject: Re: glove selection MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Zack Mansdorf, Ph.D., CIH, CSP, put together the "Quick Selection Guide to Chemical Protective Clothing" published by Van Nostrand Reinhold. Very useful...covers both suits and gloves. Scott Davis, CIH University Industrial Hygienist University of North Carolina at Charlotte > -----Original Message----- > From: Karla Bowers [SMTP:bowers@CNCACC.CN.EDU] > Sent: Thursday, April 29, 1999 3:17 PM > To: LABSAFETY-L@SIU.EDU > Subject: glove selection > > Friends, > > Two questions; one general, one specific: > > The general one: Is (are) there a good resource(s) for choosing a glove > material for a specific chemical? I've looked at the selection charts in > catalogs but they are very short. I have some general guidelines but I > would > like something more specific. > > The specific one: What is the glove of choice for > 2,4-dinitrophenylhydrazine? > Is there a resource that lists this chemical specifically or must I > generalize > based on its hazards? > > Thank you, > Karla Bowers > Carson-Newman College > bowers@cncacc.cn.edu ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 15:11:43 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Mary Ann Solstad Subject: Re: glove selection In-Reply-To: <199904291813.NAA25108@saluki-mailsmtp.siu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 02:16 PM 4/29/99 EST, you wrote: >Friends, > >Two questions; one general, one specific: > >The general one: Is (are) there a good resource(s) for choosing a glove >material for a specific chemical? I've looked at the selection charts in >catalogs but they are very short. I have some general guidelines but I would >like something more specific. > >The specific one: What is the glove of choice for 2,4-dinitrophenylhydrazine? >Is there a resource that lists this chemical specifically or must I generalize >based on its hazards? > >Thank you, >Karla Bowers >Carson-Newman College >bowers@cncacc.cn.edu > Karla, You could generalize based on it's physical characteristics (not necessarily its hazards), or better yet, cut up some glove samples and run permeability and such experiments. Mary Ann Mary Ann Solstad, CIH 4 A's of Safety SOLSTAD Health & Safety Evaluations Attitude 16 Pequot Rd, Marblehead, MA 01945 Awareness 781-631-4748 tel, 781-631-1832 FAX Automatic Application Authority Past Chair, DivCHAS, ACS msolstad@mediaone.net ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 15:21:38 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Jeff Rubin Subject: Re: glove selection In-Reply-To: <82ACF9C810A5D211B13100A0C9EBE41EB5416E@email.uncc.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/enriched; charset="us-ascii" It is a good one. Here's the full reference: HelveticaForsberg, K., and Mansdorf, S.Z., 1997, Quick Selection Guide to Chemical Protective Clothing, 3rd Ed.: Van Nostrand Reinhold, New York, 118 p. ISBN: 0-442-02377-4 >Zack Mansdorf, Ph.D., CIH, CSP, put together the "Quick Selection Guide to >Chemical Protective Clothing" published by Van Nostrand Reinhold. Very >useful...covers both suits and gloves. If you want to spend more $ (~ $100 vs. $25), CRC publishes Protective Gloves for Occupational Use (Mellstrom et al., eds.,1994), ISBN 0-8493-7359-X. JNR Jeff Rubin, Asst. Dean for EHS College of Natural Sciences G2500 W.C. Hogg Building University of Texas at Austin Austin, TX 78712-1199 (512) 471-6176 (O) (512) 471-4998 (F) jrubin@mail.utexas.edu http://www.utexas.edu/cons/safety/ "The opinions of Dr. Rubin are not meant to offend anyone unless otherwise specified." ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 15:24:11 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Jeff Rubin Subject: Re: campus transport of chemicals In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" A little tidbit in the DOT discussion: US DOT still regulates ambulances and integral equipment on them, including roll-out stretchers. National EMT curriculum was developed and is approved by DOT. JNR Jeff Rubin, Asst. Dean for EHS College of Natural Sciences G2500 W.C. Hogg Building University of Texas at Austin Austin, TX 78712-1199 (512) 471-6176 (O) (512) 471-4998 (F) jrubin@mail.utexas.edu http://www.utexas.edu/cons/safety/ "The opinions of Dr. Rubin are not meant to offend anyone unless otherwise specified." ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 15:12:40 -0500 Reply-To: joey-michael@uiowa.edu Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Joey Michael Subject: Re: Automobile transport of chemicals In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19990429131143.0095c100@postoffice.purdue.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit For air transport of hazardous materials I suggest yo read the information on your airline ticket that specifically talks about hazardous materials transport - even household products. My tickets from three different carriers had this info. on them. -----Original Message----- From: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List [mailto:LABSAFETY-L@SIU.EDU]On Behalf Of Dr. Linda A. Swihart Sent: Thursday, April 29, 1999 1:12 PM To: LABSAFETY-L@SIU.EDU Subject: Automobile transport of chemicals At 01:47 PM 4/29/99 -0400, you wrote: >A query, a little off thread: > >Can one carry, legally, non-hazardous materials in one's car? > >How about airplanes? I'm going to suppose that the "non-" part was a slip. Is there some possibility that transporting hazardous materials such as insect repellant, gasoline, Bo-Peep ammonia, and the gallon of MEK I picked up at the hardware store yesterday is illegal? And while we're at it, the bagger at the grocery but the Bo-Peep and the Chlorox in the same bag. Did he do something illegal? When I flew to New Orleans last summer I took a 2 oz container of 95% N,N-diethyl-m-toluamide (triple-bagged in ziploc-type baggies) in my luggage. Was that probably OK? ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 13:08:44 -0700 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Nadine Grady Subject: Re: glove selection MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit The "Quick Selection Guide to Chemical Protective Clothing" by Mansdorf is also available from NIOSH on the Internet at http://www.cdc.gov/niosh/ncpc1.html ************************************************************** Nadine B. Grady, MS, CIH Chemical Hygiene Officer Whitworth College 300 W. Hawthorne Rd. Spokane, WA 99251-3903 (509) 777-4510 ngrady@whitworth.edu ******************************************************************* "There are old researchers and there are bold researchers, but there are no old, bold researchers!" -- Anon. ******************************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 14:02:40 -0700 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Debbie Decker Subject: Re: campus transport of chemicals In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At a previous employer, the campus was bisected by a rather busy public road, used as a shortcut for many commuters to get from one part of town to another, bypassing the freeway. Anyway, we had to move chemicals and haz waste about the campus, crossing the public road and at times, travelling along the roadway. There's an exemption for "perpendicularly crossing the public roadway from one private facility to another so long as there is no travel along the public road" in the DOT regs but no exemption for our situation. I researched the issue with the Division of Motor Carriers at the DOT who were quite sympathetic to my plight and no real help. From somewhere (the source escapes me at the moment) I managed to come up with a copy of a letter of interpretation for the University of Chicago, in a similar situation as mine (moving haz waste, in particular, along a public roadway required placarding the vehicle, manifesting, HM181 packaging, haz mat endorsement on my driver's license, registration and inspection of my golf cart, etc, ad nauseum). The gist of it was that movement of haz waste along public roads within the perimeter of the University grounds was exempt from the requirements listed above. DOT in my area was willing to accept this interpretation. I seem to remember in 1997'ish a softening of the interpretation of the regulations on this issue, particularly wrt military bases and universities. That transportation stuff, I think, is at home. Hopefully, I didn't leave it behind somewhere. If I come across it, I'll re-post to the list. Hope this helps, Deb. Debbie M. Decker, Health and Safety Specialist Environmental Health and Safety University of California, Davis 1 Shields Ave. Davis, CA 95616 (530)754-7964 (530)752-1493 dmdecker@ucdavis.edu ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 16:43:10 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "Dr. Linda A. Swihart" Subject: Job Opening - Hazardous Materials Manager Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Purdue Univeristy Hazardous Materials Manager position opening Friday 4/30/99. >Posting #: 80659 >JOB TITLE: HAZARDOUS MATERIALS MANAGER >W LAF 0050A12 EXEMPT PROFESSIONAL >DATE OPEN: 04/30/99 RADIOLOGICAL & ENVIRONMENTAL MANAGEMENT > REGULAR -- FULL-TIME > BS DEGREE IN CHEMISTRY, CE, ENVIRON. ENG. OR RELATED FIELD & > 5 YEARS EXPERIENCE IN A HAZARDOUS WASTE PROGRAM REQUIRED. AN > EQUIVALENT COMBINATION WILL BE CONSIDERED. ADVANCED DEGREE/ > CERTIFICATION BY A NATIONALLY RECOGNIZED TECH. ORGANIZATION > REQUIRED. DEMONSTRATED LEADERSHIP SKILLS IN SCHEDULING & > DIRECTING ACTIVITIES & PEOPLE ESSENTIAL. DIRECT HAZARDOUS > WASTE PROGRAM & RELATED PERSONNEL ACTIVITIES FOR THE REM > HAZARDOUS MATERIALS MANAGEMENT SECTION ON ALL 4 CAMPUSES. > SEND COVER LETTER & RESUME TO TEAM 2(HMM), 1663 SOUTH CAMPUS > COURTS, BLDG. C., W. LAFAYETTE IN 47907-1663. A CHECK OF > CRIMINAL CONVICTION RECORDS WILL BE MADE FOR EMPLOYMENT. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 18:11:30 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Don Abramowitz Subject: Re: campus transport of chemicals Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >A query, a little off thread: > >Can one carry, legally, non-hazardous materials in one's car? > Reply: I certainly hope we can carry non-hazardous stuff, or grocery shopping by car would be illegal. I'm fairly sure you can carry hazardous materials as well, within reason, or we couldn't buy camp stove fuel, propane cylinders, paint thinner, etc.. DOT wouldn't have jurisdiction over household activities, esp. so if it was non-commercial use. But local authorities can and do regulate this, particularly in tunnels, bridges and turnpikes. To further drift from the thread, at the "not within reason" category, we've had problems with students renting full-size helium cylinders from local party stores to fill up balloons at parties, somehow stuffing the cylinders into their cars and then rolling them along the sidewalks here to get them to their desired destination. Yikes. We try to prohibit this and offer alternatives, but I'm not certain that either the stores nor the students are breaking any laws. Interestingly, the stores get the students to sign detailed, lawyerly waivers for any damages that occur once the student touches the cylinder. >How about airplanes? Nah. They're too big to carry in a car. You would at least violate "oversize load" requirements :-) Don ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 21:28:50 -0400 Reply-To: Bob Burns Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Bob Burns Subject: Re: campus transport of chemicals MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Thanks for the comments, but it really was a serious question. We make ingredients for household detergents, with the same hazard ratings. Basically, they are labeled irritants. Think of laundry detergent. Can I carry samples to potential customers? It's really neat to be able to whip a sample out of your case at the appropriate time. So my question, again, is can I legally carry such samples? They are non-hazardous. Fun thread! "HAPPINESS IS A WARM PUPPY!" Bob & Evelyn Burns Mill Hall, PA ----- Original Message ----- From: Don Abramowitz To: Sent: Thursday, April 29, 1999 6:11 PM Subject: Re: campus transport of chemicals > >A query, a little off thread: > > > >Can one carry, legally, non-hazardous materials in one's car? > > > Reply: I certainly hope we can carry non-hazardous stuff, or grocery > shopping by car would be illegal. I'm fairly sure you can carry hazardous > materials as well, within reason, or we couldn't buy camp stove fuel, > propane cylinders, paint thinner, etc.. DOT wouldn't have jurisdiction > over household activities, esp. so if it was non-commercial use. But > local authorities can and do regulate this, particularly in tunnels, > bridges and turnpikes. > > To further drift from the thread, at the "not within reason" category, > we've had problems with students renting full-size helium cylinders from > local party stores to fill up balloons at parties, somehow stuffing the > cylinders into their cars and then rolling them along the sidewalks here to > get them to their desired destination. Yikes. We try to prohibit this and > offer alternatives, but I'm not certain that either the stores nor the > students are breaking any laws. Interestingly, the stores get the students > to sign detailed, lawyerly waivers for any damages that occur once the > student touches the cylinder. > > >How about airplanes? > > Nah. They're too big to carry in a car. You would at least violate > "oversize load" requirements :-) > > Don > > ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 23:47:11 -0400 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "Julie J. O'Brien" Subject: Re: Automobile transport of chemicals Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >>For air transport of hazardous materials I suggest yo read the information on your airline ticket that specifically talks about hazardous materials transport - even household products. My tickets from three different carriers had this info. on them. >> >Yes, there are many common products that you cannot carry in an airplane. They are very strict about flammable chemicals being taken on board. Most personal care products are ok, but most other products are not. If you have something that you're not sure you should be transporting on a plane, call the airline. They can answer your questions. > >Is there some >>possibility that transporting hazardous materials such as insect repellant, >>gasoline, Bo-Peep ammonia, and the gallon of MEK I picked up at the >>hardware store yesterday is illegal? > >Consumer products are exempt from DOT regs IF it is packaged as it would be sold to a consumer. So, a semi-truck full of bottles of Chlorox would not be regulated. Something to think about. > >>When I flew to New Orleans last summer I took a 2 oz container of 95% >>N,N-diethyl-m-toluamide (triple-bagged in ziploc-type baggies) in my >>luggage. Was that probably OK? > >I don't think that N,N-diethyl-m-toluamide is flammable, so the airline would probably not be too concerned. However, a small bottle of toluene would be a problem. But, N,N-diethyl-m-toluamide is considered a carcinogen. Hmm...Still, you were not selling it so I guess it's not regulated by DOT??? > >Julie O'Brien >These opinions are definitely my own and may not be very reliable. The law is too confusing!!!! What ever you do, don't ask a lawyer about these issues. Ugh. > > > Julie O'Brien EXPO The Children's Museum of Gainesville Education and Exhibits Committee PO Box 5951 Gainesville, FL 32627 Archimica (Florida) Inc. [formerly PCR] Chemist, Research & Development PO Box 1466 Gainesville, FL 32602 352-376-8246 ext. 232 ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 30 Apr 1999 08:08:54 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "L. James Stock III" <34EMQ6K@CMUVM.CSV.CMICH.EDU> Subject: Re: campus transport of chemicals Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Here at Central Michigan University I transport chemicals and hazardous waste around campus in my Kawasaki Mule 1000. I drive on the sidewalks and only cross public roads at right angles. This has worked extremely well for me. If I have 55 gallons of waste to deal with I just have the drums picked up by my waste hauler at their location. No regs to worry about when flying around campus in my Mule and its a blast. ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 30 Apr 1999 15:47:33 +200 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Conrad Bosch Organization: National Centre Occupational Health Subject: Re: campus transport of chemicals In-Reply-To: <199904301204.HAA47426@saluki-mailsmtp.siu.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Hi Mr. James Stock Do you think flying around the campus with hazardous chemicals is a good idea, and especially with students appearing out of nowhere! Regards Conrad Bosch National Centre for Occupational Health South-Africa ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 30 Apr 1999 08:47:52 -0700 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "John M. Neil" Subject: transport of hazardous materials in POV's Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Whether it is legal or not, hazardous waste are regularily transported by the public. One can buy muriatic acid by the case for your swimming pool, and there is that 32 gallon tank of gasoline in your SUV. There are periodic posting to this news group concerning house hold items with nasty stuff in them. Last I heard, about 25% of the hazardous waste in municipal landfills was from home owners. Looking at the placarding requirements (1000 kg of hazardous materials or 1 kg of acutely hazardous before required) really puts it in prospective -- authorities are most concerned about large amounts where a spill requires evacuating a neighborhood, i.e. a gasoline tanker truck with its load spilled verses a SUV with a ruptured gas tank. John Neil ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 30 Apr 1999 13:58:59 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: "L. James Stock III" <34EMQ6K@CMUVM.CSV.CMICH.EDU> Subject: Re: campus transport of chemicals Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Ever heard of a figure of speech? I have been at my job over 20 years so I think I know what I am doing. How about yourself? Lighten up man! ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 30 Apr 1999 14:20:39 -0700 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Teresa Robertson Organization: CSU Bakersfield Subject: Consulting Services Comments: cc: trobertson@csubak.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit What might we want to take into consideration prior to offering consulting services (health and safety)? What legal obligations would we have? What type and how much insurance coverage? What in the way of certification and licensing? Other concerns? Teresa ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 30 Apr 1999 18:26:47 -0500 Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Don Abramowitz Subject: AIHA Conference, Toronto In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Are any other NACHOs going to the American Industrial Hygiene Assocation Conference/Exposition in Toronto in June? If so, I'd like to figure out a time for us to meet up, for lunch or something, to say hello in person. Please advise. Don ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Donald Abramowitz, CIH Occupational and Environmental Safety Officer Bryn Mawr College | Swarthmore College 101 N. Merion Avenue | 500 College Avenue Bryn Mawr, PA 19010 | Swarthmore PA 19081 ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 30 Apr 1999 23:25:02 EDT Reply-To: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List Sender: LABSAFETY-L Discussion List From: Labsafe@AOL.COM Subject: Re: AIHA Conference, Toronto MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi NACHOs, Pat Hamm from LSW will be conducting a professional development course on effective presentations ... Jim ***************************************************** James A. Kaufman, Director The Laboratory Safety Workshop Safety in Science Education 192 Worcester Road, Natick, MA 01760 508-647-1900 Fax: 508-647-0062 Cell: 508-574-6264 Email: labsafe@aol.com Web Site: http://www.labsafety.org/ ******************************************************